Return-path: X-Andrew-Authenticated-as: 0;andrew.cmu.edu;Network-Mail Received: from andrew.cmu.edu via trymail for info-andrew+@andrew.cmu.edu (->+dist+/afs/andrew.cmu.edu/usr0/ak99/dists/info-andrew-nostrip.dl) ID ; Mon, 1 Mar 1993 12:01:46 -0500 (EST) Received: from po3.andrew.cmu.edu via qmail ID ; Mon, 1 Mar 1993 11:59:13 -0500 (EST) Received: from vnet.ibm.com by po3.andrew.cmu.edu (5.54/3.15) id for info-andrew+; Mon, 1 Mar 93 11:58:50 EST Received: from RCHLAND by vnet.ibm.com (IBM VM SMTP V2R2) with BSMTP id 9739; Mon, 01 Mar 93 11:55:20 EST Reply-To: "Jay Schmidgall" Received: by po1.rchland.ibm.com (5.51/4.7) id for info-andrew+@andrew.cmu.edu; Mon, 1 Mar 93 10:31:43 CST Received: via switchmail; Mon, 1 Mar 1993 10:31:40 -0600 (CST) Received: from ghostwind.rchland.ibm.com via qmail ID ; Mon, 1 Mar 1993 10:00:04 -0600 (CST) Received: from ghostwind.rchland.ibm.com via qmail ID ; Mon, 1 Mar 1993 10:00:02 -0600 (CST) Received: from Messages.8.5.N.CUILIB.3.45.SNAP.NOT.LINKED.ghostwind.rchland.ibm.com.rs.a ix32 via MS.5.6.ghostwind.rchland.ibm.com.rs_aix32; Mon, 1 Mar 1993 10:00:01 -0600 (CST) Message-Id: <8fYXA1091JbtFZH1pk@rchland.ibm.com> Date: Mon, 1 Mar 1993 10:00:01 -0600 (CST) From: Jay Schmidgall To: info-andrew+@andrew.cmu.edu Subject: Re: We're porting ATK to Linux. Cc: richb@rkbhome.jti.com, tytso@athena.mit.edu In-Reply-To: References: Excerpts from ext.misc.info-andrew: 28-Feb-93 We're porting ATK to Linux. Bill Cattey@athena.mit.e (320*) > At home, with a friend who has a '486 box, I'm doing a port of ATK to > Linux. Does anybody have any preliminary work on this they could share? > Of CRUCIAL interest is: "How does the Linux Shared Library stuff work?" > Does it (Please God) use the standard SysV dlopen? You might get a lot better information if you posted to comp.os.linux, or perhaps asked Linus himself (he could probably at least direct you to the proper people). I recall seeing at least one post over in c.o.l about someone porting ATK; you might find some people over there with work in progress. : jay Return-path: X-Andrew-Authenticated-as: 0;andrew.cmu.edu;Network-Mail Received: from po3.andrew.cmu.edu via trymail for info-andrew+@andrew.cmu.edu (->+dist+/afs/andrew.cmu.edu/usr0/ak99/dists/info-andrew-nostrip.dl) ID ; Tue, 2 Mar 1993 02:54:39 -0500 (EST) Received: from po5.andrew.cmu.edu via qmail ID ; Tue, 2 Mar 1993 02:51:22 -0500 (EST) Received: from ucbvax.Berkeley.EDU by po5.andrew.cmu.edu (5.54/3.15) id for info-andrew; Tue, 2 Mar 93 02:51:16 EST Received: by ucbvax.Berkeley.EDU (5.63/1.43) id AA20288; Mon, 1 Mar 93 23:39:36 -0800 Received: from USENET by ucbvax.Berkeley.EDU with netnews for info-andrew@andrew.cmu.edu (info-andrew@andrew.cmu.edu) (contact usenet@ucbvax.Berkeley.EDU if you have questions) Date: 1 Mar 93 09:42:24 GMT From: pipex!bnr.co.uk!uknet!liv!lucs!stuart@uunet.uu.net (Stuart Mac Glashan) Organization: Computer Science, Liverpool University Subject: Feedback From CMU Message-Id: Sender: info-andrew-request@andrew.cmu.edu To: info-andrew@andrew.cmu.edu Hello, we're involved in writing a book on software reuse and as part of this book we'd like to cover simple software documentation retrieval systems as examples of the basic principles involved in this aspect of reuse. Obviously we've done the UNIX(tm) man command but we'd like to do the Andrew Help system and explain all the advantages it offers. The best way to do this would be to include screen dumps of the system in operation. Getting the dumps is technically not a problem, but we would like to know from whom do we need permission to use them ? (Assuming that we can.) Thanks in advance Return-path: X-Andrew-Authenticated-as: 0;andrew.cmu.edu;Network-Mail Received: from po2.andrew.cmu.edu via trymail for info-andrew+@andrew.cmu.edu (->+dist+/afs/andrew.cmu.edu/usr0/ak99/dists/info-andrew-nostrip.dl) ID ; Tue, 2 Mar 1993 15:04:07 -0500 (EST) Received: from po3.andrew.cmu.edu via qmail ID ; Tue, 2 Mar 1993 15:01:24 -0500 (EST) Received: from LOAN1.SP.CS.CMU.EDU by po3.andrew.cmu.edu (5.54/3.15) id for wjh+; Tue, 2 Mar 93 15:01:07 EST Received: from Messages.8.5.N.CUILIB.3.45.SNAP.NOT.LINKED.LOAN1.SP.CS.CMU.EDU.sun4.mach via MS.5.6.LOAN1.SP.CS.CMU.EDU.sun4_mach; Tue, 2 Mar 1993 14:59:59 -0500 (EST) Message-Id: <0fYvmzm00gpmQ3cHA_@cs.cmu.edu> Date: Tue, 2 Mar 1993 14:59:59 -0500 (EST) From: Wilfred.Hansen@cs.cmu.edu To: Info-Andrew Subject: C++ Conversion If anyone has a convincing argument about why we should NOT proceed with conversion of AUIS to C++, now would be a good time to come forward. Barring unforeseen arguments, we are planning to proceed with conversion to C++ in the near future, hoping to be done by the end of the year. Fred Hansen Return-path: X-Andrew-Authenticated-as: 0;andrew.cmu.edu;Network-Mail Received: from andrew.cmu.edu via trymail for info-andrew+@andrew.cmu.edu (->+dist+/afs/andrew.cmu.edu/usr0/ak99/dists/info-andrew-nostrip.dl) ID ; Tue, 2 Mar 1993 15:26:24 -0500 (EST) Received: from po5.andrew.cmu.edu via qmail ID ; Tue, 2 Mar 1993 15:20:42 -0500 (EST) Received: from njitgw.njit.edu by po5.andrew.cmu.edu (5.54/3.15) id for info-andrew+; Tue, 2 Mar 93 15:20:22 EST Received: by njitgw.njit.edu (5.57/Ultrix3.0-C) id AA27293; Tue, 2 Mar 93 15:20:11 -0500 Received: by des.njit.edu (4.1/SMI-4.1) id AA03036; Tue, 2 Mar 93 15:20:12 EST Date: Tue, 2 Mar 93 15:20:12 EST From: juneja@des.njit.edu (himanshu juneja) Message-Id: <9303022020.AA03036@des.njit.edu> To: info-andrew+@andrew.cmu.edu Hi We are trying to use help as a centralized aid for all the Engg. Softwares in Our labs. Everything looks good except for one problem, that is there is no facility for providing multiple levels i.e. you only can have one main menu level thru programs and overview windows. To get around this problem without rewriting the code we thought of a solution like this popup #help -new second level in the alias file, this woks ok except that it gives an annoying message sorry no help available on popup and then brings the next window, in fact this message comes up for any program run from help.aliases file with #command mode, is this a bug in help or one can get around this ? also the documentation I found on help was Maint.doc and various .help file for help program. Is there more documentation on help and is there any update to Maint.doc (last update 11/89) ? Himanshu Juneja Graduate Assistant, Engg. Labs New Jersey Inst. of Tech., Newark, NJ Return-path: X-Andrew-Authenticated-as: 0;andrew.cmu.edu;Network-Mail Received: from po3.andrew.cmu.edu via trymail for info-andrew+@andrew.cmu.edu (->+dist+/afs/andrew.cmu.edu/usr0/ak99/dists/info-andrew-nostrip.dl) ID ; Tue, 2 Mar 1993 16:50:20 -0500 (EST) Received: from po3.andrew.cmu.edu via qmail ID ; Tue, 2 Mar 1993 16:48:39 -0500 (EST) Received: from LOAN1.SP.CS.CMU.EDU by po3.andrew.cmu.edu (5.54/3.15) id for wjh+; Tue, 2 Mar 93 16:48:18 EST Received: from Messages.8.5.N.CUILIB.3.45.SNAP.NOT.LINKED.LOAN1.SP.CS.CMU.EDU.sun4.mach via MS.5.6.LOAN1.SP.CS.CMU.EDU.sun4_mach; Tue, 2 Mar 1993 16:47:29 -0500 (EST) Message-Id: <8fYxLlO00gpmA3cKFF@cs.cmu.edu> Date: Tue, 2 Mar 1993 16:47:29 -0500 (EST) From: Wilfred.Hansen@cs.cmu.edu To: Info-Andrew Subject: Visual Programming There is a Visual Programming conference coming up in the Fall. It seems to me that ATK is ideal for building Visual Sublanguages in that ATK offers mechanisms for embedding objects into text. The underlying text would be the program itself and embedded objects would serve as portions of the program written in visual sublanguages. In other words, it may be better to write programs in a mixture of text and graphics. Question: Has anyone implemented any visual programming facilities in ATK? They could be embeddable sublanguages as proposed above or could be entire visual languages. For example, a flow chart language ro a data flow language. Some examples I have come up with: a) srctext Programs created with srctext may now contain objects inside comments. This is not actually visual programming, but does make prettier programs. (the programs can be subsequently editted with other editors, but the objects withint the comments are unintelligible.) b) macros The new macro creation facility offers programming-by-example, which is a category of visual programming. The user first does a sequence of operations and then has then converted to a macro in Ness code where they can be editted further. c) ADEW ADEW and its "Arbcon" offer visual rogramming to create the visible user interface for programs. d) Pattern specification When pattern specifications are implemented for Ness, there will eventually be a picture form of such patterns. The ocassional user can create and edit the pattern in its picture form while power user can program in the corresponding textual form. If you know of other examples of visual programming tools or experiments with AUIS, I would be glad to hear from you. Perhaps we can work on joint or coordinated papers for the conference. Fred Hansen Return-path: X-Andrew-Authenticated-as: 8158;andrew.cmu.edu;David Anderson Received: from carnot.itc.cmu.edu via trymail for info-andrew+@andrew.cmu.edu (->+dist+/afs/andrew.cmu.edu/usr0/ak99/dists/info-andrew-nostrip.dl) ID ; Tue, 2 Mar 1993 16:56:35 -0500 (EST) If-Type-Unsupported: send Received: from carnot.itc.cmu.edu via qmail ID ; Tue, 2 Mar 1993 16:53:47 -0500 (EST) Received: from Messages.8.5.N.CUILIB.3.45.SNAP.NOT.LINKED.carnot.itc.cmu.edu.rs.aix31 via MS.5.6.carnot.itc.cmu.edu.rs_aix31; Tue, 2 Mar 1993 16:53:43 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: Date: Tue, 2 Mar 1993 16:53:43 -0500 (EST) From: David Anderson X-Andrew-Message-Size: 400+0 Content-Type: X-BE2; 12 To: Wilfred.Hansen@cs.cmu.edu Subject: Re: C++ Conversion CC: Info-Andrew In-Reply-To: <0fYvmzm00gpmQ3cHA_@cs.cmu.edu> References: <0fYvmzm00gpmQ3cHA_@cs.cmu.edu> Return-path: X-Andrew-Authenticated-as: 1447;andrew.cmu.edu;Gary Keim Received: from rascal.andrew.cmu.edu via trymail for info-andrew+@andrew.cmu.edu (->+dist+/afs/andrew.cmu.edu/usr0/ak99/dists/info-andrew-nostrip.dl) ID ; Tue, 2 Mar 1993 18:11:28 -0500 (EST) If-Type-Unsupported: send Received: from rascal.andrew.cmu.edu via qmail ID ; Tue, 2 Mar 1993 18:10:49 -0500 (EST) Received: from Messages.8.5.N.CUILIB.3.45.SNAP.NOT.LINKED.rascal.andrew.cmu.edu.rs.aix31 via MS.5.6.rascal.andrew.cmu.edu.rs_aix31; Tue, 2 Mar 1993 18:10:49 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <8fYyZtS00Woh59QVoD@andrew.cmu.edu> Date: Tue, 2 Mar 1993 18:10:49 -0500 (EST) From: Gary Keim X-Andrew-Message-Size: 851+0 Content-Type: X-BE2; 12 To: Info-Andrew Subject: Re: help command aliases In-Reply-To: <9303022020.AA03036@des.njit.edu> References: <9303022020.AA03036@des.njit.edu> Return-path: X-Andrew-Authenticated-as: 0;andrew.cmu.edu;Network-Mail Received: from po4.andrew.cmu.edu via trymail for info-andrew+@andrew.cmu.edu (->+dist+/afs/andrew.cmu.edu/usr0/ak99/dists/info-andrew-nostrip.dl) ID ; Tue, 2 Mar 1993 20:25:32 -0500 (EST) Received: from po5.andrew.cmu.edu via qmail ID ; Tue, 2 Mar 1993 20:23:41 -0500 (EST) Received: from ucbvax.Berkeley.EDU by po5.andrew.cmu.edu (5.54/3.15) id for info-andrew; Tue, 2 Mar 93 20:23:28 EST Received: by ucbvax.Berkeley.EDU (5.63/1.43) id AA01045; Tue, 2 Mar 93 17:09:37 -0800 Received: from USENET by ucbvax.Berkeley.EDU with netnews for info-andrew@andrew.cmu.edu (info-andrew@andrew.cmu.edu) (contact usenet@ucbvax.Berkeley.EDU if you have questions) Date: 1 Mar 93 23:51:54 GMT From: agate!howland.reston.ans.net!usc!news.service.uci.edu!gordius!gordius!joh nk@ucbvax.Berkeley.EDU (John Kalucki) Organization: Gordian; Costa Mesa, CA Subject: MH -> Mesages? Message-Id: <1993Mar1.235154.27923@gordian.com> Sender: info-andrew-request@andrew.cmu.edu To: info-andrew@andrew.cmu.edu Sorry if this is a FAQ. I haven't been keeping up with things here and I've just recently managed to bring up Messages from the binary distribution. My user base has quite a few messages in mh/xmh format. These messages are numbered sequentially (1 2 3 4, etc) in each folder. I'd like to be able to move these over to Messages and have all of the dates show up correctly. I've tried copying them over to the appropriate .MESSAGES directory and running CUI RECONSTRUCT and it hasn't worked. First I used option 2 (parse by date), which changed the 'ls -l' date to the correct date, but Messages showed the date to be that of the copy date (today). I then tried option 1 on these correctly dated files (time stamp on the raw files), and the date still showed today in messages. The curious thing is what decode_id shows: decode_id YfYdovQ00k00J4WYF= ``YfYdovQ00k00J4WYF='': generated 1 Mar 1993 at 15:33:15 PST from [0.3.0.0], pid 17546, ctr (mod 256) of 68. Any clues on how to convert fairly massive numbers of old mh/xmh files over to Messages? I've converted mh/xmh files to umpteen different mail systems, I hope I don't get shown up by Messages! -John Kalucki johnk@gordian.com Return-path: X-Andrew-Authenticated-as: 0;andrew.cmu.edu;Network-Mail Received: from po5.andrew.cmu.edu via trymail for info-andrew+@andrew.cmu.edu (->+dist+/afs/andrew.cmu.edu/usr0/ak99/dists/info-andrew-nostrip.dl) ID ; Tue, 2 Mar 1993 20:40:39 -0500 (EST) Received: from po3.andrew.cmu.edu via qmail ID ; Tue, 2 Mar 1993 20:38:56 -0500 (EST) Received: from alpha.xerox.com by po3.andrew.cmu.edu (5.54/3.15) id for info-andrew+; Tue, 2 Mar 93 20:38:41 EST Received: from holmes.parc.xerox.com ([13.1.100.162]) by alpha.xerox.com with SMTP id <11815>; Tue, 2 Mar 1993 17:38:22 PST Received: by holmes.parc.xerox.com id <16134>; Tue, 2 Mar 1993 17:38:11 -0800 Received: from Messages.7.15.N.CUILIB.3.45.SNAP.NOT.LINKED.holmes.parc.xerox.com.sun4.41 via MS.5.6.holmes.parc.xerox.com.sun4_41; Tue, 2 Mar 1993 17:38:06 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: Date: Tue, 2 Mar 1993 17:38:06 PST Sender: Bill Janssen From: Bill Janssen X-Andrew-Message-Size: 310+0 Content-Type: X-BE2; 12 If-Type-Unsupported: send To: Wilfred.Hansen@cs.cmu.edu, David Anderson Subject: Re: C++ Conversion Cc: Info-Andrew In-Reply-To: References: <0fYvmzm00gpmQ3cHA_@cs.cmu.edu> Return-path: X-Andrew-Authenticated-as: 0;andrew.cmu.edu;Network-Mail Received: from andrew.cmu.edu via trymail for info-andrew+@andrew.cmu.edu (->+dist+/afs/andrew.cmu.edu/usr0/ak99/dists/info-andrew-nostrip.dl) ID ; Wed, 3 Mar 1993 05:56:19 -0500 (EST) Received: from andrew.cmu.edu via qmail ID ; Wed, 3 Mar 1993 05:54:40 -0500 (EST) If-Type-Unsupported: send Received: from po5.andrew.cmu.edu via qmail ID ; Wed, 3 Mar 1993 05:47:34 -0500 (EST) Received: from lune.csc.liv.ac.uk by po5.andrew.cmu.edu (5.54/3.15) id for info-andrew+; Wed, 3 Mar 93 05:47:16 EST Received: from ind.csc.liv.ac.uk by lune.csc.liv.ac.uk with SMTP (16.8/LUCS-1.3) id AA15080; Wed, 3 Mar 93 10:47:02 GMT Received: by ind.csc.liv.ac.uk id AA20667; Wed, 3 Mar 93 10:47:01 GMT Received: from Messages.8.5.N.CUILIB.3.45.SNAP.NOT.LINKED.indus.HP9000.710 via MS.5.6.indus.hp800; Wed, 3 Mar 1993 10:46:59 +0000 (GMT) Message-Id: Date: Wed, 3 Mar 1993 10:46:59 +0000 (GMT) From: Martin Beer Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII To: Info-Andrew Subject: Re: C++ Conversion Cc: diaper@compsci.liverpool.ac.uk, rada@compsci.liverpool.ac.uk In-Reply-To: <0fYvmzm00gpmQ3cHA_@cs.cmu.edu> References: <0fYvmzm00gpmQ3cHA_@cs.cmu.edu> Excerpts from Andrew: 2-Mar-93 C++ Conversion Wilfred.Hansen@edu.cmu.c (299) > If anyone has a convincing argument about why we should NOT proceed with > conversion of AUIS to C++, now would be a good time to come forward. > Barring unforeseen arguments, we are planning to proceed with conversion > to C++ in the near future, hoping to be done by the end of the year. > Fred Hansen I will very much welcome conversion to C++. This will considerably reduce the "intellectual overload" of students starting to develop systems in Andrew. They currently have to learn a lot about the development environment, which they would already be familiar with from other courses, if the they were working in C++. Also, I am under a lot of pressure to develop multimedia systems that are portable between workstations and PCs (I have just helped prepare a large grant proposal which required this). There are already good C++ development environments on PCs which make full use of the multimedia facilities of Windows. Developing our systems in C++ would allow us to develop that portability. I wait with baited breath. Cheers Martin Dr. Martin Beer, Department of Computer Science, Telephone 051-794-3672 University of Liverpool, Fax: 051-794-3715 Chadwick Tower, P.O. Box 147, EMail mdb@uk.ac.liverpool.compsci LIVERPOOL. L69 3BX. United Kingdom. Return-path: X-Andrew-Authenticated-as: 0;andrew.cmu.edu;Network-Mail Received: from po5.andrew.cmu.edu via trymail for info-andrew+@andrew.cmu.edu (->+dist+/afs/andrew.cmu.edu/usr0/ak99/dists/info-andrew-nostrip.dl) ID ; Wed, 3 Mar 1993 10:39:40 -0500 (EST) Received: from po5.andrew.cmu.edu via qmail ID ; Wed, 3 Mar 1993 10:38:42 -0500 (EST) If-Type-Unsupported: send Received: from po3.andrew.cmu.edu via qmail ID ; Wed, 3 Mar 1993 10:35:55 -0500 (EST) Received: from thumper.bellcore.com by po3.andrew.cmu.edu (5.54/3.15) id for info-andrew; Wed, 3 Mar 93 10:35:43 EST Received: from greenbush.bellcore.com by thumper.bellcore.com (4.1/4.7) id for info-andrew@andrew.cmu.edu; Wed, 3 Mar 93 10:35:41 EST Received: by greenbush.bellcore.com (4.1/4.7) id for info-andrew@andrew.cmu.edu; Wed, 3 Mar 93 10:35:39 EST Received: from Messages.8.5.N.CUILIB.3.45.SNAP.NOT.LINKED.greenbush.galaxy.sun4.41 via MS.5.6.greenbush.galaxy.sun4_41; Wed, 3 Mar 1993 10:35:34 -0500 (EST) Message-Id: Date: Wed, 3 Mar 1993 10:35:34 -0500 (EST) From: Nathaniel Borenstein Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII To: info-andrew@andrew.cmu.edu Subject: Re: MH -> Mesages? In-Reply-To: <1993Mar1.235154.27923@gordian.com> References: <1993Mar1.235154.27923@gordian.com> I think you're getting bitten by some recently-added code that tries to be a bit too clever when it does the reconstruction. The following sounds stupid, but might fix the problem: 1. Create a new empty message folder "foobar". 2. Copy the .MS_MsgDir file from the foobar folder into the folder you want to reconstruct, thus overwriting its own .MS_MsgDir. 3. Reconstruct using option #2. I think this should work. The problem, I think, is code that tries to salvage apparently-undamaged information from the old version of the .MS_MsgDir file. -- NB Return-path: X-Andrew-Authenticated-as: 91;andrew.cmu.edu;Tom Neuendorffer Received: from highland.itc.cmu.edu via trymail for info-andrew+@andrew.cmu.edu (->+dist+/afs/andrew.cmu.edu/usr0/ak99/dists/info-andrew-nostrip.dl) ID ; Thu, 4 Mar 1993 11:18:45 -0500 (EST) Received: from highland.itc.cmu.edu via qmail ID ; Thu, 4 Mar 1993 11:15:48 -0500 (EST) Received: from Messages.8.5.N.CUILIB.3.45.SNAP.NOT.LINKED.highland.itc.cmu.edu.rs.aix31 via MS.5.6.highland.itc.cmu.edu.rs_aix31; Thu, 4 Mar 1993 11:15:47 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: Date: Thu, 4 Mar 1993 11:15:47 -0500 (EST) From: Tom Neuendorffer X-Andrew-Message-Size: 1844+0 Content-Type: X-BE2; 12 If-Type-Unsupported: send To: wjh+@andrew.cmu.edu Subject: Re: C++ Conversion CC: Info-Andrew In-Reply-To: <0fYvmzm00gpmQ3cHA_@cs.cmu.edu> References: <0fYvmzm00gpmQ3cHA_@cs.cmu.edu> Return-path: X-Andrew-Authenticated-as: 5904;andrew.cmu.edu;Robert Andrew Ryan Received: from atk.itc.cmu.edu via trymail for info-andrew+@andrew.cmu.edu (->+dist+/afs/andrew.cmu.edu/usr0/ak99/dists/info-andrew-nostrip.dl) ID ; Thu, 4 Mar 1993 12:15:44 -0500 (EST) Received: from atk.itc.cmu.edu via qmail ID ; Thu, 4 Mar 1993 12:13:25 -0500 (EST) Received: from Messages.8.5.N.CUILIB.3.45.SNAP.NOT.LINKED.atk.itc.cmu.edu.rs.aix31 via MS.5.6.atk.itc.cmu.edu.rs_aix31; Thu, 4 Mar 1993 12:13:23 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: Date: Thu, 4 Mar 1993 12:13:23 -0500 (EST) From: Robert Andrew Ryan X-Andrew-Message-Size: 5058+0 Content-Type: X-BE2; 12 If-Type-Unsupported: send To: Info-Andrew Subject: Re: C++ Conversion In-Reply-To: References: <0fYvmzm00gpmQ3cHA_@cs.cmu.edu> Return-path: X-Andrew-Authenticated-as: 0;andrew.cmu.edu;Network-Mail Received: from po4.andrew.cmu.edu via trymail for info-andrew+@andrew.cmu.edu (->+dist+/afs/andrew.cmu.edu/usr0/ak99/dists/info-andrew-nostrip.dl) ID ; Thu, 4 Mar 1993 13:47:22 -0500 (EST) Received: from po4.andrew.cmu.edu via qmail ID ; Thu, 4 Mar 1993 13:46:05 -0500 (EST) If-Type-Unsupported: send Received: from po3.andrew.cmu.edu via qmail ID ; Thu, 4 Mar 1993 13:40:40 -0500 (EST) Received: from LOAN1.SP.CS.CMU.EDU by po3.andrew.cmu.edu (5.54/3.15) id for wjh+; Thu, 4 Mar 93 13:39:28 EST Received: from Messages.8.5.N.CUILIB.3.45.SNAP.NOT.LINKED.LOAN1.SP.CS.CMU.EDU.sun4.mach via MS.5.6.LOAN1.SP.CS.CMU.EDU.sun4_mach; Thu, 4 Mar 1993 13:38:42 -0500 (EST) Message-Id: Date: Thu, 4 Mar 1993 13:38:42 -0500 (EST) From: Wilfred.Hansen@cs.cmu.edu X-Andrew-Message-Size: 1781+0 Content-Type: X-BE2; 12 To: Info-Andrew Subject: Re: C++ Conversion Cc: Tom Neuendorffer In-Reply-To: References: <0fYvmzm00gpmQ3cHA_@cs.cmu.edu> Return-path: X-Andrew-Authenticated-as: 0;andrew.cmu.edu;Network-Mail Received: from po4.andrew.cmu.edu via trymail for info-andrew+@andrew.cmu.edu (->+dist+/afs/andrew.cmu.edu/usr0/ak99/dists/info-andrew-nostrip.dl) ID ; Thu, 4 Mar 1993 14:57:19 -0500 (EST) Received: from po3.andrew.cmu.edu via qmail ID ; Thu, 4 Mar 1993 14:53:55 -0500 (EST) Received: from alpha.xerox.com by po3.andrew.cmu.edu (5.54/3.15) id for rr2b+; Thu, 4 Mar 93 14:53:45 EST Received: from holmes.parc.xerox.com ([13.1.100.162]) by alpha.xerox.com with SMTP id <11614>; Thu, 4 Mar 1993 11:53:26 PST Received: by holmes.parc.xerox.com id <16134>; Thu, 4 Mar 1993 11:53:22 -0800 Received: from Messages.7.15.N.CUILIB.3.45.SNAP.NOT.LINKED.holmes.parc.xerox.com.sun4.41 via MS.5.6.holmes.parc.xerox.com.sun4_41; Thu, 4 Mar 1993 11:53:20 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: Date: Thu, 4 Mar 1993 11:53:20 PST Sender: Bill Janssen From: Bill Janssen To: Info-Andrew , Robert Andrew Ryan Subject: Re: C++ Conversion In-Reply-To: References: <0fYvmzm00gpmQ3cHA_@cs.cmu.edu> Excerpts from ext.andrew: 4-Mar-93 Re: C++ Conversion Robert Andrew Ryan@andre (5058+0) >> 3. Will some specific C++ compiler have to be running on all AUIS >> platforms? Will it need to be modified? > For the base situation of no shared libraries and no dynamic linking any > C++ compiler should suffice. This can get a bit difficult. For example, I have four C++ compilers for the SparcStation here, and none of them support templates or exceptions. In particular, G++ is widely regarded as one of the least standard (though nice) implementations. Things get particularly difficult if > C++ programmers should be completely comfortable programming in whatever > style they wish. This makes adding garbage collection to Andrew (which I've successfully done with CLASS), pretty much infeasible. Ah, well... have a nice life. Bill Return-path: X-Andrew-Authenticated-as: 0;andrew.cmu.edu;Network-Mail Received: from po5.andrew.cmu.edu via trymail for info-andrew+@andrew.cmu.edu (->+dist+/afs/andrew.cmu.edu/usr0/ak99/dists/info-andrew-nostrip.dl) ID ; Thu, 4 Mar 1993 14:57:37 -0500 (EST) Received: from po3.andrew.cmu.edu via qmail ID ; Thu, 4 Mar 1993 14:55:45 -0500 (EST) Received: from alpha.xerox.com by po3.andrew.cmu.edu (5.54/3.15) id for info-andrew; Thu, 4 Mar 93 14:55:20 EST Received: from holmes.parc.xerox.com ([13.1.100.162]) by alpha.xerox.com with SMTP id <11641>; Thu, 4 Mar 1993 11:54:55 PST Received: by holmes.parc.xerox.com id <16134>; Thu, 4 Mar 1993 11:54:52 -0800 Received: from Messages.7.15.N.CUILIB.3.45.SNAP.NOT.LINKED.holmes.parc.xerox.com.sun4.41 via MS.5.6.holmes.parc.xerox.com.sun4_41; Thu, 4 Mar 1993 11:54:48 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: Date: Thu, 4 Mar 1993 11:54:48 PST Sender: Bill Janssen From: Bill Janssen To: info-andrew@andrew.cmu.edu Subject: HTML version of text? Has anyone written HTML support for ATK yet (presumably htmltext?). (HTML is the markup system used for the WorldWideWeb project.) Bill Return-path: X-Andrew-Authenticated-as: 5904;andrew.cmu.edu;Robert Andrew Ryan Received: from atk.itc.cmu.edu via trymail for info-andrew+@andrew.cmu.edu (->+dist+/afs/andrew.cmu.edu/usr0/ak99/dists/info-andrew-nostrip.dl) ID ; Thu, 4 Mar 1993 15:10:57 -0500 (EST) Received: from atk.itc.cmu.edu via qmail ID ; Thu, 4 Mar 1993 15:10:11 -0500 (EST) Received: from Messages.8.5.N.CUILIB.3.45.SNAP.NOT.LINKED.atk.itc.cmu.edu.rs.aix31 via MS.5.6.atk.itc.cmu.edu.rs_aix31; Thu, 4 Mar 1993 15:10:10 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: Date: Thu, 4 Mar 1993 15:10:10 -0500 (EST) From: Robert Andrew Ryan X-Andrew-Message-Size: 1602+0 Content-Type: X-BE2; 12 If-Type-Unsupported: send To: Info-Andrew , Bill Janssen Subject: Re: C++ Conversion In-Reply-To: References: <0fYvmzm00gpmQ3cHA_@cs.cmu.edu> Return-path: X-Andrew-Authenticated-as: 5904;andrew.cmu.edu;Robert Andrew Ryan Received: from atk.itc.cmu.edu via trymail for +dist+/afs/andrew.cmu.edu/usr13/wjh/dlists/mts.dl@andrew.cmu.edu (->+dist+/afs/andrew.cmu.edu/usr13/wjh/dlists/mts.dl) ID ; Thu, 4 Mar 1993 16:17:03 -0500 (EST) Received: from atk.itc.cmu.edu via qmail ID ; Thu, 4 Mar 1993 16:16:53 -0500 (EST) Received: from Messages.8.5.N.CUILIB.3.45.SNAP.NOT.LINKED.atk.itc.cmu.edu.rs.aix31 via MS.5.6.atk.itc.cmu.edu.rs_aix31; Thu, 4 Mar 1993 16:16:52 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: Date: Thu, 4 Mar 1993 16:16:52 -0500 (EST) From: Robert Andrew Ryan X-Andrew-Message-Size: 505+4 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="Interpart.Boundary.IfZb73y00WoiRVXpYt" To: +dist+/afs/andrew.cmu.edu/usr13/wjh/dlists/mts.dl@andrew.cmu.edu Subject: C++ conversion files > THIS IS A MESSAGE IN 'MIME' FORMAT. Your mail reader does not support MIME. > Please read the first section, which is plain text, and ignore the rest. --Interpart.Boundary.IfZb73y00WoiRVXpYt Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII [An Andrew ToolKit view (a hyperlink) was included here, but could not be displayed.] (Describes how a C++ programmer will program with a C++ ATK.) [An Andrew ToolKit view (a hyperlink) was included here, but could not be displayed.](Describes the tasks which the converter program must do.) [An Andrew ToolKit view (a hyperlink) was included here, but could not be displayed.](Describes the basic goals driving the design of the conventions and the converter.) [An Andrew ToolKit view (a hyperlink) was included here, but could not be displayed.] (Describes the tasks which we need to do to make a C++ version of ATK, and provide the promised demo at the annual meeting.) (These files are in ~rr2b/work/proposals.) I'd like to have a meeting before the regular meeting Monday, or perhaps 11am Tuesday? (It'll probably be ~1hr or less.) -Rob --Interpart.Boundary.IfZb73y00WoiRVXpYt Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="Alternative.Boundary.IfZb73y00WoiBVXpU:" --Alternative.Boundary.IfZb73y00WoiBVXpU: Content-type: application/andrew-inset --Alternative.Boundary.IfZb73y00WoiBVXpU: Content-type: text/richtext; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable (Describes how a C++ programmer will program with a C++ ATK.) --Alternative.Boundary.IfZb73y00WoiBVXpU: Content-type: application/andrew-inset --Alternative.Boundary.IfZb73y00WoiBVXpU: Content-type: text/richtext; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable (Describes the tasks which the converter program must do.) --Alternative.Boundary.IfZb73y00WoiBVXpU: Content-type: application/andrew-inset --Alternative.Boundary.IfZb73y00WoiBVXpU: Content-type: text/richtext; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable (Describes the basic goals driving the design of the conventions and the converter.) --Alternative.Boundary.IfZb73y00WoiBVXpU: Content-type: application/andrew-inset --Alternative.Boundary.IfZb73y00WoiBVXpU: Content-type: text/richtext; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable (Describes the tasks which we need to do to make a C++ version of ATK, and provide the promised demo at the annual meeting.) (These files are in ~rr2b/work/proposals.) I'd like to have a meeting before the regular meeting Monday, or perhaps 11am Tuesday? (It'll probably be ~1hr or less.) -Rob --Alternative.Boundary.IfZb73y00WoiBVXpU:-- --Interpart.Boundary.IfZb73y00WoiRVXpYt-- Return-path: X-Andrew-Authenticated-as: 0;andrew.cmu.edu;Network-Mail Received: from po2.andrew.cmu.edu via trymail for info-andrew+@andrew.cmu.edu (->+dist+/afs/andrew.cmu.edu/usr0/ak99/dists/info-andrew-nostrip.dl) ID ; Thu, 4 Mar 1993 16:52:18 -0500 (EST) Received: from po5.andrew.cmu.edu via qmail ID ; Thu, 4 Mar 1993 16:49:38 -0500 (EST) Received: from sadye.emba.uvm.edu by po5.andrew.cmu.edu (5.54/3.15) id for rr2b+; Thu, 4 Mar 93 16:49:29 EST Received: by sadye.emba.uvm.edu id AA09930 (5.65/6.02); Thu, 4 Mar 93 16:49:09 -0500 Date: Thu, 4 Mar 93 16:49:09 -0500 From: Garrett.Wollman@UVM.EDU Message-Id: <9303042149.AA09930@sadye.emba.uvm.edu> To: Robert Andrew Ryan Cc: Bill Janssen , Info-Andrew Subject: Re: C++ Conversion In-Reply-To: References: <0fYvmzm00gpmQ3cHA_@cs.cmu.edu> < said: > True, but one of the biggest arguments for the move to C++ is > attempting to minimize the learning curve for programmers starting > to write with ATK. Can you comment on what restrictions or > conventions might be needed for ATK to provide garbage collection > under C++? I would point out that G++ already has minimal support for at least *someone's* garbage-collector. I would draw your attention to the `-fgc' option of cc1plus, implemented by `cp-gc.c' in the version that I have. The header says: /* Garbage collection primitives for GNU C++. Copyright (C) 1992 Free Software Foundation, Inc. Contributed by Michael Tiemann (tiemann@cygnus.com) So I would recommend asking him about it. -GAWollman -- Garrett A. Wollman | Shashish is simple, it's discreet, it's brief. ... wollman@emba.uvm.edu | Shashish is the bonding of hearts in spite of distance. uvm-gen!wollman | It is a bond more powerful than absence. We like people UVM disagrees. | who like Shashish. - Claude McKenzie + Florent Vollant Return-path: X-Andrew-Authenticated-as: 0;andrew.cmu.edu;Network-Mail Received: from po5.andrew.cmu.edu via trymail for info-andrew+@andrew.cmu.edu (->+dist+/afs/andrew.cmu.edu/usr0/ak99/dists/info-andrew-nostrip.dl) ID ; Thu, 4 Mar 1993 18:18:13 -0500 (EST) Received: from po3.andrew.cmu.edu via qmail ID ; Thu, 4 Mar 1993 18:17:11 -0500 (EST) Received: from alpha.xerox.com by po3.andrew.cmu.edu (5.54/3.15) id for rr2b+; Thu, 4 Mar 93 18:17:05 EST Received: from holmes.parc.xerox.com ([13.1.100.162]) by alpha.xerox.com with SMTP id <12032>; Thu, 4 Mar 1993 15:15:30 PST Received: by holmes.parc.xerox.com id <16134>; Thu, 4 Mar 1993 15:15:20 -0800 Received: from Messages.7.15.N.CUILIB.3.45.SNAP.NOT.LINKED.holmes.parc.xerox.com.sun4.41 via MS.5.6.holmes.parc.xerox.com.sun4_41; Thu, 4 Mar 1993 15:15:19 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <4fZcq7IB0KGWA2qUpd@holmes.parc.xerox.com> Date: Thu, 4 Mar 1993 15:15:19 PST Sender: Bill Janssen From: Bill Janssen X-Andrew-Message-Size: 668+0 Content-Type: X-BE2; 12 If-Type-Unsupported: send To: Info-Andrew , Bill Janssen , Robert Andrew Ryan Subject: Re: C++ Conversion In-Reply-To: References: <0fYvmzm00gpmQ3cHA_@cs.cmu.edu> Return-path: X-Andrew-Authenticated-as: 0;andrew.cmu.edu;Network-Mail Received: from po5.andrew.cmu.edu via trymail for info-andrew+@andrew.cmu.edu (->+dist+/afs/andrew.cmu.edu/usr0/ak99/dists/info-andrew-nostrip.dl) ID ; Thu, 4 Mar 1993 19:49:52 -0500 (EST) Received: from po3.andrew.cmu.edu via qmail ID ; Thu, 4 Mar 1993 19:47:59 -0500 (EST) Received: from nkosi.well.sf.ca.us by po3.andrew.cmu.edu (5.54/3.15) id for rr2b+; Thu, 4 Mar 93 19:47:32 EST Received: from well.sf.ca.us by nkosi.well.sf.ca.us (5.65c/SMI-4.1/nkosi-930216-1) id AA03331; Thu, 4 Mar 1993 16:46:27 -0800 Received: by well.sf.ca.us (5.65c/SMI-4.1/well-930216-1) id AA07473; Thu, 4 Mar 1993 16:45:43 -0800 Received: from zindigo by z-code.com (4.1/NBN-16/ZC-7) id AA12834; Thu, 4 Mar 93 16:17:57 PST Received: by zindigo (920330.SGI/920502.SGI) for @z-code.z-code.com:parc.xerox.com!janssen id AA08813; Thu, 4 Mar 93 16:23:25 -0800 From: bobg@zindigo.z-code.com (Bob Glickstein) Message-Id: <9303041623.ZM8811@zindigo.z-code.com> Date: Thu, 4 Mar 1993 16:23:24 -0800 In-Reply-To: Robert Andrew Ryan "Re: C++ Conversion" (Mar 4, 3:10pm) References: <0fYvmzm00gpmQ3cHA_@cs.cmu.edu> Organization: Z-Code Software Corp., Marin County, CA Reply-To: Bob Glickstein X-Face: =($SY|/2Odk(K$UOYYH88u8x@sP9c'l[^RZwSi<=~B9w.bD}Xueurgex5p1D:0')q.qr8iC%%