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From: elna@netcom.com (Esperanto League N America)
Subject: Re: languages & happiness!!
Message-ID: <elnaE4v0E2.Avu@netcom.com>
Organization: Esperanto League for North America, Inc.
References: <853605030.2652@dejanews.com> <32EE36DE.4009@sn.nono> <32f67c11.24001502@news.mindspring.com> <32EE8747.6566@sn.nono>
Date: Fri, 31 Jan 1997 06:22:50 GMT
Lines: 59
Sender: elna@netcom11.netcom.com

ablehr@sn.nono writes in a recent posting (reference <32EE8747.6566@sn.nono>):
>D Gary Grady wrote:
>
>> Anders Blehr <ablehr@sn.nono> wrote:
>> 
>Esperanto League N America seemed to claim that *because* they were
>speaking Esperanto, they were able to speak about the "heart of Russian
>culture", without realizing that the reason why they were able to do
>this was because they both spoke their language of communication
>perfectly, and *not* because this language happened to be Esperanto.
>
I regret that my description gave you this impression. I am not so 
foolish as to believe this: we were able to have this conversation
because the medium was well enough designed to be applied at high levels
of sophistication with short study. I know no Russian; few Russians have
anything beyond basic English. It is common to have a well-developed
mutual language if you hang around Esperanto circles. Of course, if I were a 
Sanskrit scholar and hung around in international Sanskrit conventions, I 
might well learn about the heart of Russian (or Japanese) culture by means
of this language...

>> >Well, how about people communicating in other languages, should they,
>> >because of their "natural enthusiasm for people with whom they can
>> >[communicate]" in a certain language, not try and communicate with those
>> >speaking another language they too speak.  What's important is what you
>> >have to say, not what language you use to say it.
>> 
>> Of course; who would argue otherwise?
>
>Esperanto League N America, who stated that "the pleasure of using
>Esperanto is so keen and immediate that those who are left out will
>*feel* left out!".

Have you never been caught up in the enthusiastic use of a language
so that common courtesy is ignored for a time? I have often felt great
relief after weeks of struggling in German to find some English-speakers
and rudely allowed my German friends to feel left out for some time.

So for the most part, I agree with you & Gary that what is said is more
important than what language is used to say it; yet I hope you can accept
that there are social settings in which idle chatter in one language is
more enjoyable that profound discourse in another.

Don't get me wrong here: I am not dismissing your description of the rude
behaviour of those Esperantists in the train-- I am merely pointing out that
there is real pleasure of sharing conversation in a language which one has 
missed, and that this joy can lead to ignoring or even snubbing others.

Again this is not peculiar to Esperanto: I might have made a more general
statement like "the pleasure of speaking a language one knows well is so
keen &c." As Gary Grady pointed out, one can achieve this level of 
proficiency much faster in Esperanto than (in my experience) German or
French.

-- 
Miko SLOPER              elna@netcom.com              USA  (510) 653 0998
Direktoro de la          ftp.netcom.com:/pub/el/elna   fax (510) 653 1468 
Centra Oficejo de la     Learn Esperanto! Free lessons: e-mail/snail-mail
Esperanto-Ligo de N.A.   Write to above address or call:  1-800-ESPERANTO
