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From: collim@anubis.network.com (Mike Collins)
Subject: Re: English importation of words (was Re: Is '#' a "pound sign" or what?)
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Date: Mon, 4 Mar 1996 14:16:00 GMT
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In article <825589254snz@gbutler.demon.co.uk>, Geoff@gbutler.demon.co.uk 
says...
>
>In article 
<Pine.SOL.3.91.960228115847.2106A-100000@lonestar.jpl.utsa.edu>
>           cthorpe@lonestar.jpl.utsa.edu "Cissy . Thorpe" writes:
>
>> The Brits pronounce it "buff-et"  They have a distinct dislike for all
>> things French and often deliberately mispronounce French words common 
to
>> English.
>
>No they don't, if you mean it in the sense of trying to hold a glass
>and a plate and a fork without spilling too much from any of them
>onto your shoes. In that sense, they rarely pronounce the 't'.
>
>It's true that the Brits and the French don't see eye to eye on many
>things, but that's not the same as dislike, and I don't think it's
>relevant here. Most imports into English are immediately anglicised,
>which is not too bad an idea, whereas many imports from French retain
>some semblance of French pronunciation. Are you suggesting that *any*
>anglophone nation is capable, in general, of *correctly* pronouncing
>French words?
>
>Geoff Butler

Well said, Geoff!  As an Englishman with an interest in the English 
language, who spent seven years working in Paris (fifteen years ago) and 
who married a French girl whilst there; who learned French, and whose wife 
has now learned English, I consider myself something of an expert on this 
topic. I actually find that there is a good degree of affection between 
the French and the English from both sides. I was always treated as 
something of a mini-celebrity while I was there, simply through being an 
Englishman with an interest in improvement of my French pronounciation and 
vocabulary. If there is any intolerance, I perceive it as being more with 
the English than with the French.

When words are imported into English from a foreign source, one of three 
things happens: i) The word continues to be both pronounced and spelt as 
the foreign nation pronounces and spells it (eg Buffet) ii) the word is 
pronounced as as an anglophone would read it from the original spelling, 
or iii) the spelling is so modified as to represent in English the way it 
is pronounced by its hosts. This is not always nation-wide, and there are 
certainly English people who pronounce "buffet" as "buffette", though I 
don't think they form tha majority.

The French do this too. For example, they have adopted the term "WC" for 
"toilet". Nobody knows that it stands for Water Closet, but they pronounce 
it "Doob-le-Vay-Say", as a french person would read the initials. It is 
occasionally also known as "Le Watter" (also from water, as we have 
adopted "Loo" from L'eau - meaning water).

With the changes that easy world-wide travel / communications brings to 
all languages of large populations, I believe that all nations do the same 
thing.English has always had a very open attitude to accepting words from 
elsewhere: "Blitzkrieg" became current during the last war, at a time when 
anything with German connections was despised, but it seemed a snappier 
description of what it described than anything current in English at the 
time.

The one I'm waiting for is "Bricoler", "Bricloage" - the French word for 
what we call DIY or Do-It-Yourself - anything to do with messing about and 
making / doing things in an unprofessional, figure-it-out way. I find the 
English expression cumbersome, and the older word of Tinkering seems to 
have largely fallen from popularity.

Sorry, folks. All this has mighty little to do with dialling or the # 
sign.

Mike.

