From mmunsey@mit.nospam.edu Tue Apr 14 19:32:33 EDT 1998 Article: 125854 of alt.religion.scientology Path: mistletoe.srv.cs.cmu.edu!honeysuckle.srv.cs.cmu.edu!bb3.andrew.cmu.edu!nntp.sei.cmu.edu!news.cis.ohio-state.edu!magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu!csn!nntp-xfer-1.csn.net!denver-news-feed1.bbnplanet.com!su-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!cpk-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!news.bbnplanet.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!206.20.110.210!fresh!anon.lcs.mit.edu!nym.alias.net!mail2news Message-ID: <199804140411.VAA17370@logicon.com> Subject: ATG: Leading Physicist on MIT Atom Laser Team Explains the BASER From: Matthew Munsey Date: Tue, 14 Apr 1998 00:14:59 -0400 Newsgroups: alt.religion.scientology,sci.skeptic,sci.physics,sci.chem,sci.engr.chem,alt.business,misc.invest.stocks References: <6ggu41$912@news3.newsguy.com> <35219de3.28272053@news.newsguy.com> <352c62b2.12055107@news.newsguy.com> <352a891b.3674464@news.newsguy.com> <352826fd.31867966@news.newsguy.com> Organization: Massachvsetts Institvte of Technology Mail-To-News-Contact: postmaster@nym.alias.net Lines: 72 Xref: skinner.boltz.cs.cmu.edu alt.religion.scientology:125854 misc.invest.stocks:82364 Sorry to be posting this again, but the headers were mangled last time and I wasn't sure that anyone had the chance to see it. Any thoughts? -- Matt -------- Since there seems to have been a lot of discussion lately about the American Technologies Group ( http://www.ateg.com/ ) and their "research and development," I thought maybe I'd get some firsthand information. Specifically, the description of the Baser(tm) on the ATG website makes quite a few references to the development of the atom laser here at MIT. As it turns out, the leader of the MIT research group that actually obtained Bose-Einstein condensate and later the atom laser is the recitation instructor for my 8.059 (Quantum Physics III) class! So I asked Prof. Wolfgang Ketterle if he knew of the Baser(tm) and how it related to his own research. I'm including the statement that Dr. Ketterle said I could share with the public in the message below. He carefully uses scientific considerations to describe how the Baser(tm) differs from his group's development of the atom laser. Feel free to look through the excellent set of web pages for the MIT BEC group, where their research and background information is thoughtfully explained. Although Prof. Ketterle was very kind and helpful to talk to me about this, I think he would prefer not to have his mailbox flooded with further inquiries into this matter. But if you are interested, feel free to reply to me (remove nospam from the mmunsey e-mail address). This should clear up some of the questions people have as to the validity of this research and its applications. Matt Munsey, MIT '00 mmunsey@mit.nospam.edu Addresses changed for privacy: ------ Date: Wed, 8 Apr 1998 17:53:06 -0400 To: Matthew Munsey From: Wolfgang Ketterle Subject: Re: The "Baser" The charged helium cluster beam, called BASER, has been compared to the atom laser. This comparison is misleading: The atom laser is a beam of coherent atoms which propagate like a big matter wave similar to the photons in the laser. In contrast, the helium clusters behave like classical particles. However, since the helium is cooled below the transition to superfluidity, the helium atoms WITHIN the cluster are coherent - this is the phenomenon of superfluidity which was discovered around 1938 and is well understood. All the applications discussed of the BASER are applications related solely to the energy and momentum of the particles and not to any superfluid properties. To give an example: When you are hit by a thermos full of liquid helium, it doesn't make a difference whether the helium is superfluid or not. Therefore the BASER should be regarded as an ordinary charged particle beam. The physics of helium clusters is well understood, and didn't need any confirmation through the realization of the atom laser. The statement on the ATG home page that the "MIT experiment ... validates the scientific merit of research on coherent beams of heavy particles" is correct, but it has NOTHING to do with the suggested applications of the BASER. Read the whole web page on the BASER carefully: It doesn't make any false claims, it doesn't state anywhere that the superfluid properties of the clusters are relevant for any of the applications considered. However, the web page gives the impression that coherence, laser-like properties, Bose-Einstein condensation etc. play a role for the applications of the BASER, but they don't. _____________________________________________________________________ Wolfgang Ketterle MIT, Room 26-243, 77 Massachusetts Ave., Cambridge, MA 02139, USA Tel. 1-617-253-6815, FAX 1-617-253-4876, e-mail: wolfgang@xxx.edu http://amo.mit.edu/Ketterle.html; group: http://amo.mit.edu/~bec/