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From: pandries@alis.ca (Patrick Andries)
Subject: Re: ESPERANTO - SPAM SPAM SPAM, SPAM SPAM SPAM
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Date: Thu, 23 Feb 1995 20:00:38 GMT

In article <3ii43o$mi6@lyra.csx.cam.ac.uk> etg10@cl.cam.ac.uk (Edmund Grimley-Evans) writes:
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>From: etg10@cl.cam.ac.uk (Edmund Grimley-Evans)
>Newsgroups: alt.politics.ec,alt.politics.eu,sci.lang,soc.culture.europe,soc.culture.french,soc.culture.german
>Subject: Re: ESPERANTO - SPAM SPAM SPAM, SPAM SPAM SPAM
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C,est bientt fini cette pollution de l'espace de soc.culture.french. Votre 
sujet - en anglais - ne concerne en rien la culture franaise. On peut 
permettre de temps  autres des messages dont la lien avec la culture 
franaise est tnu - mais ici a commence  me les gonfler !

D'ailleurs, on dirait que s.c.f devient de plus en plus le centre de 
renseignements pour amricains qui cherche des infos (en anglais) sur la 
France sans trop se fouler. Y a vraiment plus grand-chose d'intressants.

O est la bonne poque ?


>> a normal history of learning languages:
>> (at least in north germany)
>> 
>> first language: saxonian (or PLATT) that's what all your neighbours and
>>                 your parents talk.

>I thought Plattdeutsch was nearing extinction. (Germana Esperanto-Junularo
>produced a leaflet about Esperanto in Plattdeutsch, but I gather this was
>more a way of showing their solidarity with "smaller" languages than a
>serious way of informing North Germans. But I know there's a difference
>between writing Platt and speaking it ...)

>> Your neighbours don't talk it, it's not spoken in the TV, its not spoken  
>> in the scientific community, no poems or philosophies are written in it,  
>                               --------

>Poems are written in Esperanto. You haven't been paying attention.

>> BTW: to learn other language means to learn parts of other cultures.  
>> Therefore we should not stop to learn. .. and dear fans of E.: can you  
>> name ONE CULTURE that stems from E. ??

>Cultures don't usually "stem from" languages, and cultures don't
>usually have names.

>> a language without a culture behind it (a *dead* language) is useless and  
>> I wonder if human (!) communication is possible at all .. or you have to  
>> *cross_reference* to languages with a cultural tradition. like e.g.: ...  
>> ummm, hhhmmmm, eerrr, i understand <love> like "amor-fati", as described  
>> by Friedrich Nietzsche in his work "Froehliche Wissenschaft" ....."  or  
>> whatsoever examples....

>The expression "dead language" is either obsolete or unscientific. In
>colloquial usage it means a language that was spoken in the past but
>is not spoken at present. (It may of course be spoken again in the
>future, and this is where the analogy with biological death breaks down.)

>Since Esperanto is not dead, then it can not be "without culture"
>according to your reasoning. (Whatever the expression "without culture"
>means when applied to a human language.)

>The meaning of an Esperanto word is defined by is usage. A monolingual
>Esperanto dictionary is full of examples, just like a dictionary of
>any other language. You may add explicit references to German
>philosophers if you wish, but it rather takes the romance out of
>"Mi amas vin", IMO.

>Edmundo <etg10@cam.ac.uk>          http://www.cl.cam.ac.uk/users/etg10/

