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From: pruss@helix.nih.gov (dmitry pruss)
Subject: Cyr->Lat switch in Romanian, summary
Message-ID: <1994Sep28.135154.3085@alw.nih.gov>
Sender: postman@alw.nih.gov (AMDS Postmaster)
Organization: National Institutes of Health, Bethesda, MD, 20892
Date: Wed, 28 Sep 1994 13:51:54 GMT
Lines: 85

A long-promised summary: 

ADP: From: Andrei Dan Popovici <andrei@leland.Stanford.EDU>
DV: From: Dmitri Vulis 
GD: From: byztalk@strateg1.demon.co.uk (Grigore Dumitrescu)
TB: From T. Balan 
VS: From: Virgil Simplaceanu <vs2a+@andrew.cmu.edu>

>-I understand that XVIIth century Moldova used Cyrillic. What about
>Walachia? 

ADP>Wallachia used the cyrillic alphabet also.  This is probably because most
ADP>if not all the writing at the time was religious.
ADP>Some non-religious writing was in the latin alphabet--one of the earliest
ADP>I think was Cantemir's book on Moldova in the 17th century (I can't
ADP>rememeber what it was called--basically it was a book about the
ADP>geography and history of Moldova).

>-in a Catholic-dominated Transylvania, were there independent attempt to
>use Latin script for vernacular?

(sorry , I can't attribute a quote properly, but I was explained that
Transylvania was largely Protestant and since the Reformation the Latin
wasn't the law of the religion there - but, importantly, Latin was the
language of administration and law in Transylvania) 

GD>The struggle in favour of the Latin Alphabet, planned by the leaders of the
GD>Transylvanian School about the end of the 18th century and openly launched 
GD>around 1800, was not an easy one. It was necessary to change an entire
GD>mentality born on familiarity with the Cyrillic alphabet. The difficulty arose
GD>also from the fact that even the Romanian liturgical books, until then printed 
GD>in the cyrillic characters, provided that alphabet with a certain sanction,
GD>almost a religious flavour. 
GD>
GD>Nevertheless, the Latin alphabet emerged victorious from the contest. Its 
GD>official triumph in the new Romania was realised in 1860 when the Cyrillic 
GD>alphabet was finally abandoned.

DV: points out that the Anglo-French victory over Russia in Crimean war
(1856) precipitated the event. 

TB>Orthodox Church had no many rights under the hungarian catholic domination.
							  ^^^^^^^^see above
TB>Some religious/patriotic/political guys created a church (that still exists)
TB>called greek-catholic, wich was recognising the pape but keeped all the 
TB>other orthodox rites, books, philosophy. So they went over the hungarians 
TB>to a direct conection with the pape, who gave them the right to make schools
			 ^^^^^^^^^^^^^this doesn't sound right, but I
			 couldn't check it 
TB>and books in latin. This was the begining of national resurection for the romanians
TB>of Transylvania...

> -was indeed Serbian 'dzhe' present and Russian 'bI' absent from the old
> Romanian Cyrillic script? 

DV> yes to dzhe and yn 

>-when Latin was used as a Church language? When it ceased to be used?

ADP>I don't remember Latin as a church language (outside of Transylvania).
ADP>I think in Moldova and Wallachia the switch was from Slavonic to
ADP>Romanian (again, I may be wrong on this).

GD: mentions a letter of the Bishops of the _Southern side of the Danube
written in Latin (VIth cent.) 
>
>-there's an ethnic group called Walachs in xYugoslavia and Albania - do
>they have any relationship to Romanians

ADP>They speak a related language, but I don't think there is a definitive 
ADP>theory as to how the two peoples are related.

VS>And about the Vlachs in Albania, fY and Greece: I don't have any recent
VS>info, but they speak one of the four Romanian dialects, the
VS>Macedo-Romanian (Aromana), the other three being the mainstream Romanian
VS>(also called Daco-Romanian, spoken North an around the Danube valley),
VS>Megleno-Romanian (in Northeastern Greece, now practically extinct) and
VS>Istro-Romanian (in the Istria Peninsula region, now also extinct).
VS>The Vlachs (Macedo-Rmanians) were mentioned in old census polls, around
VS>the turn of the century, but I don't know what are the recent figures.
VS>They were kept down by all political regimes of that area and subject to
VS>forced assimilation. The Greeks even deny their existence.
 


