From bnr.co.uk!D.W.Wright Fri Feb 26 16:56:10 1993 Received: from eurogate.bnr.co.uk ([192.100.101.3]) by scapa.cs.ualberta.ca with SMTP id <42198>; Fri, 26 Feb 1993 16:55:49 -0700 Received: from bnr.co.uk by eurogate.bnr.co.uk with SMTP (PP) id <15855-0@eurogate.bnr.co.uk>; Fri, 26 Feb 1993 23:54:06 +0000 Received: from bnr.co.uk by hedera.bnr.co.uk with SMTP (PP) id <10512-0@hedera.bnr.co.uk>; Fri, 26 Feb 1993 23:53:59 +0000 Date: Fri, 26 Feb 1993 16:53:23 -0700 Message-Id: <00968bb63a6a3aec@ash.bnr.co.uk> From: David Wright Subject: Re: RFD: comp.object.logic=comp.lang.prolog.oo X-VMS-Mail-Cc: DWW To: vladimir@cs.ualberta.ca X-VMS-Mail-To: INET%"vladimir@cs.ualberta.ca" Status: OR David Lawrence, the news.announce.newgroups moderator, has passed your article to group-advice, for us to comment on. (In the past he did it all himself, but for the past couple of years we've been helping out). Your proposal looks fine to me, except for one real problem: > This is a request for discussion of the proposal to create an > unmoderated Usenet newsgroup called "comp.object.logic" > which also is to be aliased (duplicated) as "comp.lang.prolog.oo". > These names, positions in the tree, whether the group should appear > at two places and if so which should be the host place, are not final; > other suggestions are welcome during the discussion. Do you have any idea how to do this? You can cross-post articles so they appear in two news groups, but you cannot cross-connect groups themselves. You could do it on one particular computer of course, but not for the other 99,999 on the net (or is it 999,999 :-). Actually, in theory, you could create two moderated news groups, and have the moderator post everything to both. However, they would still be separate groups that just happened to have the same articles in. I have met programmimg languages where you can distinguish between an object, its representation(s), its name(s), and references to it, and give all of those names, (including the object's names, as they are objects too), but Usenet isn't that flexible. Just one name per subject area. Sorry! Please rewrite your RFD, with either a single name suggested, or else suggesting two and asking for people to say which they prefer. There must be a single name when it gets to the CFV stage. Regards, David Wright BNR Europe Ltd, London Road, Harlow, Essex CM17 9NA, UK dww@bnr.co.uk dww@bnr.ca uunet!stl!dww PSI%234237100122::DWW From comp.lang.prolog Wed Mar 10 15:49:46 1993 From: vladimir@cs.ualberta.ca (Vladimir Alexiev) Date: 3 Mar 1993 23:31:08 -0500 Newsgroups: news.announce.newgroups,news.groups,comp.object,comp.lang.prolog Subject: RFD: comp.object.logic This is a request for discussion of the proposal to create an unmoderated Usenet newsgroup called "comp.object.logic". This name (and position in the tree) is not final; other suggestions are welcome during the discussion (for example another appropriate name would "comp.lang.prolog.oo"). PURPOSE The proposed newsgroup "comp.object.logic" is intended to serve as a medium for discussing the issues on Integrating the Object-Oriented and Logic Programming Paradigms. RATIONALE This topic is currently a rather hot one. There are at least 30 mergers of OOP and LP proposed, 20 logic theories which model aspects of OOP, numerous applications in Knowledge Representation and Deductive Object-Oriented Databases based on multiple paradigms. Currently there is no newsgroup devoted to discussions about the topic. Having one would promote exchange of information and the development of the field. CONTENT The following topics would be appropriate for the newsgroup: -languages integrating the two paradigms -logics for different aspects of OOP: -encapsulation -inheritance -mutable state -interaction through message passing -modularity -implementations of OOP in LP and vice versa -using OOP+LP for knowledge representation -applications built on integrated paradigms -applications which would benefit from -etc The newsgroup is not intended specifically for discussion of Constraint Logic Programming, Concurrent Logic Programming, Actor languages, Deductive Object-Oriented Databases but probably it can accomodate some articles on these topics as well. DISCUSSION PERIOD The discussion period will be from February 27 to March 27, 1993. Please post follow-ups to news.groups, comp.object, and comp.lang.prolog. After that period, if enough interest is shown and a consensus is reached, a CFV (call for votes) will be posted and a vote will be run. (BTW, is there anybody willing to run this vote?) The voting period will last for another 30 days. Vladimir Alexiev From comp.lang.prolog Wed Mar 10 15:49:56 1993 From: andre@swi.psy.uva.nl (Andre Valente) Date: 8 Mar 93 14:13:49 GMT Newsgroups: news.groups,comp.object,comp.lang.prolog Subject: Re: RFD: comp.object.logic In <1n40mcINNh12@rodan.UU.NET> vladimir@cs.ualberta.ca (Vladimir Alexiev) writes: + This is a request for discussion of the proposal to create an + unmoderated Usenet newsgroup called "comp.object.logic". I would like to give my support to the creation of this newsgroup. My pareticular interest is on the formalization of several aspects of the OO paradigm, particularly within AI. I think there is already enough interest and enough work on the field to deserve a new group. My only objection is to this description: + The proposed newsgroup "comp.object.logic" + is intended to serve as a medium for discussing the issues on + Integrating the Object-Oriented and Logic Programming Paradigms. I don't think that "logic programming" is a fair characterization of what logics can do for OO and vice-versa, since it is a fairly restricted part of the whole logics community. Furthermore, OO is a paradigm for many other things than programming (e.g. design). In addition, it must be observed that the original description is rather more restrictive than the list of topics (with which I completely agree, by the way). Therefore, I would rather describe the newsgroup as "a medium for discussing the issues on the interaction between the Object-Oriented paradigm and Logics (particulary logic programming)." Of course, similar texts with the same idea can work as well. ********************************** Andre' Valente University of Amsterdam andre@lri.jur.uva.nl From comp.lang.prolog Fri Mar 19 17:25:55 1993 From: holger@uran.informatik.uni-bonn.de (Holger Berse) Date: Tue, 16 Mar 1993 11:38:13 GMT Newsgroups: news.groups,comp.object,comp.lang.prolog Subject: Re: RFD: comp.object.logic In article 1n40mcINNh12@rodan.UU.NET, vladimir@cs.ualberta.ca (Vladimir Alexiev) writes: >This is a request for discussion of the proposal to create an >unmoderated Usenet newsgroup called "comp.object.logic". I do support the proposal to create that unmoderated Usenet newsgroup called "comp.object.logic". I have been working on that topic since my Diplomarbeit (Thesis) in 1990 and there is a lot of work still to be done. Most approaches to this topic I know came from >The proposed newsgroup "comp.object.logic" >is intended to serve as a medium for discussing the issues on >Integrating the Object-Oriented and Logic Programming Paradigms. Most approaches to this topic I know came from the logic programming community searching a way of integrating OOP features in Logic Programming. So a group "comp.prolog.object" would be reasonable, too. But I do prefer the first suggestion, I think anyone interested in logic and OO reads the group "comp.object". >The newsgroup is not intended specifically for discussion of >Constraint Logic Programming, Concurrent Logic Programming, >Actor languages, Deductive Object-Oriented Databases but probably >it can accomodate some articles on these topics as well. I would like the group to be used to discuss related topics as mentioned above. There are many poits of interest for Logic and Object Oriented Programming as well as for example for Deductive Object Oriented Databases. Perhaps another point of view to a problem offers new perspetives. --- /_//) Holger Berse / //_) Institut fuer Informatik III Universitaet Bonn D-W5300 Bonn 1 Deutschland Tel. (0228) 550-221 email: holger@uran.informatik.uni-bonn.de