From newshub.ccs.yorku.ca!torn!cs.utexas.edu!sun-barr!west.West.Sun.COM!smaug.West.Sun.COM!dab Wed Oct 14 14:58:09 EDT 1992
Article 7165 of comp.ai.philosophy:
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>From: dab@ism.isc.com (Dave Butterfield)
Newsgroups: comp.ai.philosophy
Subject: Re: Brain and Mind (was: Logic and God)
Date: 8 Oct 1992 18:00:36 GMT
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References: <1992Oct5.022907.6131@meteor.wisc.edu> <1992Oct5.181741.7241@spss.com> <1992Oct8.174224.20547@meteor.wisc.edu>
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tobis@meteor.wisc.edu (Michael Tobis) writes:
>Symbols are not symbols until a
>consciousness attaches a meaning to them.

I'm not convinced of this.  I think there are symbols that have
meanings below a conscious level.  I think good writers and
filmmakers and advertisers understand and exploit that.  To a cat
the sound of a can opener symbolizes food; to a dog, rolling over
and exposing the neck symbolizes submission.

One could argue that these are "lower-forms" of consciousness.  In
that case:

>How can consciousness arise from symbols when symbols cannot exist
>without consciousness?

By bootstrap from lower forms of consciousness; the same way chickens
arise from eggs when eggs cannot exist without chickens.

>It is my belief that a Turing Test passing
>algorithm is likely in the near future, but that is only because we
>are capable of being sytematically tricked, not because we have a handle
>on the nature of consciousness.

What evidence is there that human consciousness is not just a
systematic trick?

What test for consciousness would you propose instead of TT?

>This is much
>different than proposing that passing the Turing Test is sufficient
>evidence of consciousness to assign rights to AI realizations or AI
>algorithms. (Those who disagree: which would it be, btw?)

Wouldn't it make sense to treat two instantiations of the same
algorithm the same way we do twins?

Dave
-- 
          Magic is the art of assuming a role strongly enough
          that the Universe falls into the complementary role.


