\begindata{text822, 0} Return-path: X-Andrew-Authenticated-as: 0;andrew.cmu.edu;Network-Mail Received: from andrew.cmu.edu via trymail for info-andrew+@andrew.cmu.edu (->+dist+/afs/andrew.cmu.edu/usr0/ak99/dists/info-andrew-nostrip.dl) ID ; Wed, 4 Nov 1992 12:23:04 -0500 (EST) Received: from po5.andrew.cmu.edu via qmail ID ; Wed, 4 Nov 1992 12:20:59 -0500 (EST) Received: from ucbvax.Berkeley.EDU by po5.andrew.cmu.edu (5.54/3.15) id for info-andrew; Wed, 4 Nov 92 12:20:43 EST Received: by ucbvax.Berkeley.EDU (5.63/1.43) id AA23399; Wed, 4 Nov 92 09:07:01 -0800 Received: from USENET by ucbvax.Berkeley.EDU with netnews for info-andrew@andrew.cmu.edu (info-andrew@andrew.cmu.edu) (contact usenet@ucbvax.Berkeley.EDU if you have questions) Date: 3 Nov 92 00:27:33 GMT From: milo!milo!tdt@uunet.uu.net (Tim Thorpe) Organization: Verdix Corp., Herndon, VA Subject: Re: Read FAQ, printing problem, have groff, troff Message-Id: References: <1992Oct29.184846.4270@news2.cis.umn.edu> Sender: info-andrew-request@andrew.cmu.edu To: info-andrew@andrew.cmu.edu I dont believe it is possible to print "ez" files without using "ezprint". This is because "ez" uses a TeX-ish style notation and "ezprint" takes this and translates it to troff which you then need to process for your print environment. Here, we have Postscript printers and the following works for me:- ----------------- cut here ------------- #!/bin/csh ezprint -c -E -F -q -s -t $1 | eqn | ptroff -t ----------------- end here ------------- If you name the above "myez2ps" you could do:- $ myez2ps "ez-file" > "ez-file.PS" This also prints out the table of content - which I like. Note1: I believe ptroff is part of the Transcript package from Adobe. Note2: I don't see why you can't replace the "eqn | ptroff" phase with groff. Hope this helps. -- -Tim -tdt@verdix.com \enddata{text822, 0} \begindata{text822, 2168} Return-path: X-Andrew-Authenticated-as: 0;andrew.cmu.edu;Network-Mail Received: from po2.andrew.cmu.edu via trymail for info-andrew+@andrew.cmu.edu (->+dist+/afs/andrew.cmu.edu/usr0/ak99/dists/info-andrew-nostrip.dl) ID ; Fri, 6 Nov 1992 02:33:04 -0500 (EST) Received: from po5.andrew.cmu.edu via qmail ID ; Fri, 6 Nov 1992 02:30:28 -0500 (EST) Received: from ucbvax.Berkeley.EDU by po5.andrew.cmu.edu (5.54/3.15) id for info-andrew; Fri, 6 Nov 92 02:30:16 EST Received: by ucbvax.Berkeley.EDU (5.63/1.43) id AA06889; Thu, 5 Nov 92 23:19:32 -0800 Received: from USENET by ucbvax.Berkeley.EDU with netnews for info-andrew@andrew.cmu.edu (info-andrew@andrew.cmu.edu) (contact usenet@ucbvax.Berkeley.EDU if you have questions) Date: 4 Nov 92 07:25:25 GMT From: cis.ohio-state.edu!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!sol.ctr.columbia.edu!emory!europa.asd.contel.com!paladin.american.edu!news.univie.ac.at!hp4at!mcsun!Germany.EU.net!rrz.uni-koeln.de!unidui!math (Juergen Henke) Organization: Fraunhofer Inst. f. Manufact. Engineering a. Automation, Subject: Re: WYSIWYG Word Processing (Free?) Message-Id: References: <1d1c6rINNjfl@uwm.edu>, , Sender: info-andrew-request@andrew.cmu.edu To: info-andrew@andrew.cmu.edu >>>>> On 2 Nov 92 00:22:42 GMT, ddj+@cs.cmu.edu (Doug DeJulio) said: >>The question has arisen as to whether there exists a free (in *source*) >>WYSIWIG-type word-processor for UN*X systems equipped with X Windows. >Well, Carnegie-Mellon University has written a gigantic multi-media >machine called 'andrew'... Doug> You can get the Andrew software from emsworth.andrew.cmu.edu via Doug> anonymous FTP. It includes a multimedia near-WYSIWYG editor and a Doug> MIME compliant multimedia mail system. Doug> -- Doug> Doug DeJulio Doug> Member Technical Staff Doug> Andrew Consortium Is there anybody out there (:-) who give's Andrew a try on linux ? I've already spent some hours on a BSD/386 system earlier this year (no flames please) and discovered some incompatibilities between Andrew and GNU-make/-flex. The dynamic loading code shouldn't be the big problem (linux has the standard a.out format) - when memory serves me right, i had big problems with the class preprocessor due to certain bugs in flex-2.3.7 (from some discussion on the gnu.* newsgroups i'm aware that the problem is known, and that flex-2.4, which should solve it, has absolutely no time horizon...). Anybody knows a lex replacement other than flex ? Juergen P.S.: I'm cross posting this to comp.soft-sys.andrew (wanted to test the news <-> mail gateway for quite a while :-). _________________________________________________________________________ Juergen Henke, e-mail juh@IPA.FhG.de, PSI-mail PSI%4505016002::JUH_IPA Fraunhofer-Institut f. Produktionstechnik u. Automatisierung Nobelstrasse 12, D-7000 Stuttgart 80 (ATK-mail and MIME-mail welcome) -- _________________________________________________________________________ Juergen Henke, e-mail juh@IPA.FhG.de, PSI-mail PSI%4505016002::JUH_IPA Fraunhofer-Institut f. Produktionstechnik u. Automatisierung Nobelstrasse 12, D-7000 Stuttgart 80 (ATK-mail and MIME-mail welcome) \enddata{text822, 2168} \begindata{text822, 5660} Return-path: X-Andrew-Authenticated-as: 0;andrew.cmu.edu;Network-Mail Received: from po5.andrew.cmu.edu via trymail for info-andrew+@andrew.cmu.edu (->+dist+/afs/andrew.cmu.edu/usr0/ak99/dists/info-andrew-nostrip.dl) ID ; Fri, 6 Nov 1992 04:16:22 -0500 (EST) Received: from po5.andrew.cmu.edu via qmail ID ; Fri, 6 Nov 1992 04:15:04 -0500 (EST) Received: from ucbvax.Berkeley.EDU by po5.andrew.cmu.edu (5.54/3.15) id for info-andrew; Fri, 6 Nov 92 04:14:53 EST Received: by ucbvax.Berkeley.EDU (5.63/1.43) id AA11507; Fri, 6 Nov 92 01:05:58 -0800 Received: from USENET by ucbvax.Berkeley.EDU with netnews for info-andrew@andrew.cmu.edu (info-andrew@andrew.cmu.edu) (contact usenet@ucbvax.Berkeley.EDU if you have questions) Date: 3 Nov 92 23:40:54 GMT From: adobe!usenet@decwrl.dec.com (Zalman Stern) Organization: Adobe Systems Incorporated Subject: Re: WYSIWYG Word Processing (Free?) Message-Id: <1992Nov3.234054.27637@adobe.com> References: Sender: info-andrew-request@andrew.cmu.edu To: info-andrew@andrew.cmu.edu In article juh@qt.IPA.FhG.de (Juergen Henke) writes: > The dynamic loading code shouldn't be the big problem (linux has the standard > a.out format) - when memory serves me right, i had big problems with the class > preprocessor due to certain bugs in flex-2.3.7 (from some discussion on the > gnu.* newsgroups i'm aware that the problem is known, and that flex-2.4, > which should solve it, has absolutely no time horizon...). > > Anybody knows a lex replacement other than flex ? > So get somebody to lex the code for you on a system with AT&T lex and then use the resulting C file on linux. (We had to use this technique for the OS/2 port. Anybody know whatever happened to that work?) -- Zalman Stern zalman@adobe.com (415) 962 3824 Adobe Systems, 1585 Charleston Rd., POB 7900, Mountain View, CA 94039-7900 "Yeah. Ask 'em if they'll upgrade my shifters too." Bill Watterson \enddata{text822, 5660} \begindata{text822, 7930} Return-path: X-Andrew-Authenticated-as: 0;andrew.cmu.edu;Network-Mail Received: from andrew.cmu.edu via trymail for info-andrew+@andrew.cmu.edu (->+dist+/afs/andrew.cmu.edu/usr0/ak99/dists/info-andrew-nostrip.dl) ID ; Fri, 6 Nov 1992 07:54:04 -0500 (EST) Received: from po3.andrew.cmu.edu via qmail ID ; Fri, 6 Nov 1992 07:53:27 -0500 (EST) Received: from vnet.ibm.com by po3.andrew.cmu.edu (5.54/3.15) id for info-andrew; Fri, 6 Nov 92 07:53:19 EST Received: from RCHLAND by vnet.ibm.com (IBM VM SMTP V2R2) with BSMTP id 5950; Fri, 06 Nov 92 07:51:20 EST Reply-To: "Todd Inglett" Received: by po1.rchland.ibm.com (5.51/4.7) id for info-andrew@andrew.cmu.edu; Fri, 6 Nov 92 06:52:41 CST Received: via switchmail; Fri, 6 Nov 1992 06:52:38 -0600 (CST) Received: from q.rchland.ibm.com via qmail ID ; Fri, 6 Nov 1992 06:52:02 -0600 (CST) Received: from q.rchland.ibm.com via qmail ID ; Fri, 6 Nov 1992 06:52:01 -0600 (CST) Received: from Messages.8.5.N.CUILIB.3.45.SNAP.NOT.LINKED.q.rchland.ibm.com.rs.aix32 via MS.5.6.q.rchland.ibm.com.rs_aix32; Fri, 6 Nov 1992 06:52:01 -0600 (CST) Message-Id: Date: Fri, 6 Nov 1992 06:52:01 -0600 (CST) From: Todd Inglett X-Andrew-Message-Size: 571+0 Content-Type: X-BE2; 12 If-Type-Unsupported: send To: info-andrew@andrew.cmu.edu Subject: Re: WYSIWYG Word Processing (Free?) In-Reply-To: References: <1d1c6rINNjfl@uwm.edu>, , \begindata{text,538934520} \textdsversion{12} \template{messages} \excerptedcaption{Excerpts from ext.misc.info-andrew: 4-Nov-92 Re: WYSIWYG Word Processing.. mcs (1922)} \quotation{i had big problems with the class preprocessor due to certain bugs in flex-2.3.7} I have seen problems in other versions of lex, too. The problem seems to stem from the fact that a zillion keywords are listed directly in the scanner. I modifed the code to simply scan an identifier and then lookup the identifier in a hash table. I didn't notice any peformance degradation and the preprocessor was much smaller. I think I can dig up the code if you want to try it. -todd inglett \enddata{text,538934520} \enddata{text822, 7930} \begindata{text822, 10686} Return-path: X-Andrew-Authenticated-as: 0;andrew.cmu.edu;Network-Mail Received: from po2.andrew.cmu.edu via trymail for info-andrew+@andrew.cmu.edu (->+dist+/afs/andrew.cmu.edu/usr0/ak99/dists/info-andrew-nostrip.dl) ID ; Mon, 9 Nov 1992 07:54:48 -0500 (EST) Received: from po5.andrew.cmu.edu via qmail ID ; Mon, 9 Nov 1992 07:52:50 -0500 (EST) Received: from relay.iunet.it by po5.andrew.cmu.edu (5.54/3.15) id for info-andrew+; Mon, 9 Nov 92 07:52:26 EST Received: from jrc.UUCP by relay.iunet.it with UUCP (5.61++/IDA-1.2.8) id AA20499; Mon, 9 Nov 92 13:52:07 +0100 Received: from iss.isei.jrc.it (is) by jrc.it; Mon, 9 Nov 92 12:28:29 +0100 Received: from Messages.7.15.N.CUILIB.3.45.SNAP.NOT.LINKED.is.iss.isei.jrc.it.sun4.41 via MS.5.6.is.iss.isei.jrc.it.sun4_41; Mon, 9 Nov 1992 12:30:20 +0100 (MET) Message-Id: Date: Mon, 9 Nov 1992 12:30:20 +0100 (MET) From: Jose Perdigao To: Info-Andrew Subject: VUI on IBM 3270 terminal ? Hi, Is it possible to display VUI on an IBM 3270 terminal by a telnet conection to a unix machine ? If so what terminal type do I need to define in the environment variable TERM ? Thanks. \enddata{text822, 10686} \begindata{text822, 12198} Return-path: X-Andrew-Authenticated-as: 8158;andrew.cmu.edu;David Anderson Received: from carnot.itc.cmu.edu via trymail for info-andrew+@andrew.cmu.edu (->+dist+/afs/andrew.cmu.edu/usr0/ak99/dists/info-andrew-nostrip.dl) ID ; Mon, 9 Nov 1992 10:23:36 -0500 (EST) If-Type-Unsupported: send Received: from carnot.itc.cmu.edu via qmail ID ; Mon, 9 Nov 1992 10:17:56 -0500 (EST) Received: from Messages.8.5.N.CUILIB.3.45.SNAP.NOT.LINKED.carnot.itc.cmu.edu.rs.aix31 via MS.5.6.carnot.itc.cmu.edu.rs_aix31; Mon, 9 Nov 1992 10:17:53 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: Date: Mon, 9 Nov 1992 10:17:53 -0500 (EST) From: David Anderson X-Andrew-Message-Size: 216+0 Content-Type: X-BE2; 12 To: Info-Andrew , Fabio Ottolini Subject: Re: Running ATK applications in foreground ? In-Reply-To: References: \begindata{text,539219832} \textdsversion{12} \template{messages} Use the -d switch to run an ATK application, such as ez, in the foreground ez -d The choice of the letter 'd' comes from the fact that preventing forking is most often needed in order to use a debugger. --david \enddata{text,539219832} \enddata{text822, 12198} \begindata{text822, 13780} Return-path: X-Andrew-Authenticated-as: 5904;andrew.cmu.edu;Robert Andrew Ryan Received: from atk.itc.cmu.edu via trymail for info-andrew+@andrew.cmu.edu (->+dist+/afs/andrew.cmu.edu/usr0/ak99/dists/info-andrew-nostrip.dl) ID ; Mon, 9 Nov 1992 16:50:54 -0500 (EST) Received: from atk.itc.cmu.edu via qmail ID ; Mon, 9 Nov 1992 16:48:10 -0500 (EST) Received: from Messages.8.5.N.CUILIB.3.45.SNAP.NOT.LINKED.atk.itc.cmu.edu.rs.aix31 via MS.5.6.atk.itc.cmu.edu.rs_aix31; Mon, 9 Nov 1992 16:48:10 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: Date: Mon, 9 Nov 1992 16:48:10 -0500 (EST) From: Robert Andrew Ryan X-Andrew-Message-Size: 1030+0 Content-Type: X-BE2; 12 If-Type-Unsupported: send To: Info-Andrew Subject: Printers \begindata{text,538821720} \textdsversion{12} \template{messages} \define{keyword } We are investigating having ATK print direct to Postscript, to relieve the dependence on troff/groff and psdit. I'm curious how many and what different Postscript interpreter versions are being used out there. Here we have one printer with interpreter version 38.0, and another reports 52.3 (Here the version is reported on the cover page, I'm not sure if that happens in general.) The biggest issues are Level 2 operators, and ISO-Latin-1 support. Apparently ISO-Latin-1 support appeared in interpreter version 47.0. In versions prior to this there are 3 characters outright missing and a number of others which would have to be constructed by composition of other characters. The following postscript code will print the interpreter version number in the lower left corner. If you use ATK printing (or would like to) and you can, please print this on your printer(s) and let me know what it says. Thanks for any info, -Rob Ryan Andrew Consortium \bold{%! /Helvetica findfont 20 scalefont setfont \bold{100 100 moveto version show }}\enddata{text,538821720} \enddata{text822, 13780} \begindata{text822, 16019} Return-path: X-Andrew-Authenticated-as: 1210;alw.nih.gov;Bob Dew Received: from spot.dcrt.nih.gov via trymail for info-andrew+@andrew.cmu.edu (->+dist+/afs/andrew.cmu.edu/usr0/ak99/dists/info-andrew-nostrip.dl) (->+dist+/afs/andrew.cmu.edu/usr0/ak99/dists/info-andrew-nostrip.dl@andrew.cmu.edu) ID ; Mon, 9 Nov 1992 18:11:47 -0500 (EST) Received: from spot.dcrt.nih.gov via qmail ID ; Mon, 9 Nov 1992 18:10:46 -0500 (EST) If-Type-Unsupported: send Received: from spot.dcrt.nih.gov via qmail ID ; Mon, 9 Nov 1992 18:08:31 -0500 (EST) Received: from dude.dcrt.nih.gov via qmail ID ; Mon, 9 Nov 1992 18:07:26 -0500 (EST) Received: from dude.dcrt.nih.gov via qmail ID ; Mon, 9 Nov 1992 18:07:20 -0500 (EST) Received: from Messages.8.5.N.CUILIB.3.45.SNAP.NOT.LINKED.dude.dcrt.nih.gov.sun4c.411 via MS.5.6.dude.dcrt.nih.gov.sun4_41; Mon, 9 Nov 1992 18:07:20 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: Date: Mon, 9 Nov 1992 18:07:20 -0500 (EST) From: Bob_Dew@alw.nih.gov MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII To: Info-Andrew , Robert Andrew Ryan Subject: Re: Printers In-Reply-To: References: > We are investigating having ATK print direct to Postscript, to relieve the dependence on troff/groff and psdit. Aren't these dependencies necessary to support ATK's "preview"? In the long run, I'd think a device-independent troff generator would be more useful and less error prone than a direct ATK-->Postscript program. Just a thought... Our interpreter version is 52.3. -Bob \enddata{text822, 16019} \begindata{text822, 18172} Return-path: X-Andrew-Authenticated-as: 5904;andrew.cmu.edu;Robert Andrew Ryan Received: from atk.itc.cmu.edu via trymail for info-andrew+@andrew.cmu.edu (->+dist+/afs/andrew.cmu.edu/usr0/ak99/dists/info-andrew-nostrip.dl) ID ; Mon, 9 Nov 1992 19:01:48 -0500 (EST) Received: from atk.itc.cmu.edu via qmail ID ; Mon, 9 Nov 1992 19:00:52 -0500 (EST) Received: from Messages.8.5.N.CUILIB.3.45.SNAP.NOT.LINKED.atk.itc.cmu.edu.rs.aix31 via MS.5.6.atk.itc.cmu.edu.rs_aix31; Mon, 9 Nov 1992 19:00:52 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: Date: Mon, 9 Nov 1992 19:00:52 -0500 (EST) From: Robert Andrew Ryan X-Andrew-Message-Size: 2297+0 Content-Type: X-BE2; 12 If-Type-Unsupported: send To: Info-Andrew Subject: Postscript Printing Comments? (was) Re: Printers In-Reply-To: References: \begindata{text,538647148} \textdsversion{12} \template{messages} \excerptedcaption{Excerpts from internet.other.info-andrew: 9-Nov-92 Re: Printers Bob_Dew@alw.nih.gov (391*)} \quotation{Aren't these dependencies necessary to support ATK's "preview"? } Our intent is to replace preview with code which hopefully will work in the same process as the document being edited. Ideally I would like to see the Postscript printing layout technology leveraged into a true WYSIWYG editor. (though I speak only for myself on that one as far as I know...) Another less lofty goal perhaps would be a dynamic preview. \excerptedcaption{Excerpts from internet.other.info-andrew: 9-Nov-92 Re: Printers Bob_Dew@alw.nih.gov (391*)} \quotation{In the long run, I'd think a device-independent troff generator would be more useful and less error prone than a direct ATK-->Postscript program. }\quotation{ }I disagree, one of the problems with ATK printing currently is that groff, and the varieties of troff are slightly different in many respects. Another drawback of hybrid ditroff/postscript printing is that it is not possible to include an inset which prints in troff in an inset which prints in postscript and have the printing work. Perhaps it may be worthwhile for us to investigate another text formatter besides troff... Minimum requirements: 1. Documents can include embedded postscript (following the spec for EPS) 2. Font metrics must be available to ATK apps. (so they can compute their print sizes) 3. It must be possible to format text TO embedded postscript (preferably computing preferred size), and subsequently include this in a document. (text or more raw postscript.) 1 is trivial. 2 could be accomplished with gross hackery giving ATK knowledge of the mapping of troff fonts to Postscript fonts, (currently we have the technology to read AFM files). As far as I know 3 is not feasible with ditroff or groff... Neither ditroff nor groff is so powerful that I believe we will have great difficulty duplicating the functionality in a direct ATK -> PS conversion. Ditroff/groff are unattractive also in that you have to pay, or you have to get and compile gcc (and g++ if gcc <2), and libg++. Having followed the groff route for the HP 9000/700 I can say it was pretty painful. If anyone has any comments, suggestions on this topic we would be happy to hear them :-) Thanks, -Rob Ryan Andrew Consortium \enddata{text,538647148} \enddata{text822, 18172} \begindata{text822, 21911} Return-path: X-Andrew-Authenticated-as: 5904;andrew.cmu.edu;Robert Andrew Ryan Received: from atk.itc.cmu.edu via trymail for info-andrew+@andrew.cmu.edu (->+dist+/afs/andrew.cmu.edu/usr0/ak99/dists/info-andrew-nostrip.dl) ID ; Mon, 9 Nov 1992 19:17:58 -0500 (EST) Received: from atk.itc.cmu.edu via qmail ID ; Mon, 9 Nov 1992 19:17:33 -0500 (EST) Received: from Messages.8.5.N.CUILIB.3.45.SNAP.NOT.LINKED.atk.itc.cmu.edu.rs.aix31 via MS.5.6.atk.itc.cmu.edu.rs_aix31; Mon, 9 Nov 1992 19:17:32 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <4ezjyQu00WoiJ4iUcu@andrew.cmu.edu> Date: Mon, 9 Nov 1992 19:17:32 -0500 (EST) From: Robert Andrew Ryan X-Andrew-Message-Size: 348+0 Content-Type: X-BE2; 12 If-Type-Unsupported: send To: Info-Andrew Subject: Re: Printers In-Reply-To: References: \begindata{text,538678360} \textdsversion{12} \template{messages} \define{bold menu:[Font~1,Bold~10] attr:[FontFace Bold Int Set]} \excerptedcaption{Excerpts from internet.other.info-andrew: 9-Nov-92 Printers Robert Andrew Ryan (1030+0)} \bold{\quotation{%! }\quotation{/Helvetica findfont 20 scalefont setfont }\bold{\quotation{100 100 moveto version show } }} Ooops... Jason Haar pointed out to me that I forgot the showpage... So it should read: \example{%! /Helvetica findfont 20 scalefont setfont 100 100 moveto version show showpage } Thanks, -Rob \enddata{text,538678360} \enddata{text822, 21911} \begindata{text822, 23673} Return-path: X-Andrew-Authenticated-as: 0;andrew.cmu.edu;Network-Mail Received: from andrew.cmu.edu via trymail for info-andrew+@andrew.cmu.edu (->+dist+/afs/andrew.cmu.edu/usr0/ak99/dists/info-andrew-nostrip.dl) ID ; Mon, 9 Nov 1992 20:09:28 -0500 (EST) Received: from po3.andrew.cmu.edu via qmail ID ; Mon, 9 Nov 1992 20:07:46 -0500 (EST) Received: from alpha.xerox.com by po3.andrew.cmu.edu (5.54/3.15) id for rr2b; Mon, 9 Nov 92 20:07:37 EST Received: from holmes.parc.xerox.com ([13.1.100.162]) by alpha.xerox.com with SMTP id <12104>; Mon, 9 Nov 1992 17:07:14 PST Received: by holmes.parc.xerox.com id <25546>; Mon, 9 Nov 1992 17:07:10 -0800 Received: from Messages.7.15.N.CUILIB.3.45.SNAP.NOT.LINKED.holmes.parc.xerox.com.sun4.41 via MS.5.6.holmes.parc.xerox.com.sun4_41; Mon, 9 Nov 1992 17:07:08 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: Date: Mon, 9 Nov 1992 17:07:08 PST Sender: Bill Janssen From: Bill Janssen To: Info-Andrew , Robert Andrew Ryan , Bob_Dew@alw.nih.gov Subject: Re: Printers In-Reply-To: References: I think that the real dependencies fall in the realm of depending on troff for indices, tables of contents, footnotes, etc., which would all have to be done internally if direct PostScript generation (a bad idea, in my mind, for anything other than line drawings in ATK -- I'd prefer converting to TeX with some macro package) was adopted. Bill \enddata{text822, 23673} \begindata{text822, 25570} Return-path: X-Andrew-Authenticated-as: 1210;alw.nih.gov;Bob Dew Received: from spot.dcrt.nih.gov via trymail for info-andrew+@andrew.cmu.edu (->+dist+/afs/andrew.cmu.edu/usr0/ak99/dists/info-andrew-nostrip.dl) ID ; Tue, 10 Nov 1992 00:53:16 -0500 (EST) Received: from cecil.dcrt.nih.gov via qmail ID ; Tue, 10 Nov 1992 00:52:27 -0500 (EST) If-Type-Unsupported: send Received: from cecil.dcrt.nih.gov via qmail ID ; Tue, 10 Nov 1992 00:51:57 -0500 (EST) Received: from Messages.8.5.N.CUILIB.3.45.SNAP.NOT.LINKED.cecil.dcrt.nih.gov.sun4c.411 via MS.5.6.cecil.dcrt.nih.gov.sun4_41; Tue, 10 Nov 1992 00:51:57 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: Date: Tue, 10 Nov 1992 00:51:57 -0500 (EST) From: Bob_Dew@alw.nih.gov MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII To: Info-Andrew , Robert Andrew Ryan Subject: Re: Postscript Printing Comments? (was) Re: Printers In-Reply-To: References: > Our intent is to replace preview with code which hopefully will work in > the same process as the document being edited. Ideally I would like to > see the Postscript printing layout technology leveraged into a true > WYSIWYG editor. A drawback with WYSIWYG editors as you describe is that they require a binary format in which to store working drafts and editable document copies. One can rest assured that there will never exist a WYSIWYG-to-ATK interpreter. I think one of the celebrated features that ATK offers over many (if not all) commercially available counterparts is that its intermediate data format is non-proprietary and ASCII readable. This open systems approach, to coin increasingly popular buzz term, makes text formatting packages like ATK far more attractive, in my opinion, than similar look-alikes (like Rapport and Asterix, for examples) which have limited usefulness outside of their own proprietary formatting protocols. If I really wanted to use a WYSIWYG editor, I'd probably opt for something with a full range of formatting and typesetting capabilities, which in all likelihood would lie outside of what ATK could reasonably offer, and beyond what ATK has thus far been exemplary in providing. ATK's strengths lie in its simplicity, its ease of use, and in its relative ease of portability among a variety of communications systems, including on-line and printable help facilities, mail and bulletin board services, text processing utilities, etc. I think it would behoove project goals to investigate new text formatting ideas from the perspective of keeping data formats flexible, and as standard and as portable as possible. -Bob \enddata{text822, 25570} \begindata{text822, 28708} Return-path: X-Andrew-Authenticated-as: 5904;andrew.cmu.edu;Robert Andrew Ryan Received: from atk.itc.cmu.edu via trymail for info-andrew+@andrew.cmu.edu (->+dist+/afs/andrew.cmu.edu/usr0/ak99/dists/info-andrew-nostrip.dl) ID ; Tue, 10 Nov 1992 08:39:12 -0500 (EST) Received: from atk.itc.cmu.edu via qmail ID ; Tue, 10 Nov 1992 08:37:59 -0500 (EST) Received: from Messages.8.5.N.CUILIB.3.45.SNAP.NOT.LINKED.atk.itc.cmu.edu.rs.aix31 via MS.5.6.atk.itc.cmu.edu.rs_aix31; Tue, 10 Nov 1992 08:37:58 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: Date: Tue, 10 Nov 1992 08:37:58 -0500 (EST) From: Robert Andrew Ryan X-Andrew-Message-Size: 3037+0 Content-Type: X-BE2; 12 If-Type-Unsupported: send To: Info-Andrew Subject: Re: Postscript Printing Comments? (was) Re: Printers In-Reply-To: References: \begindata{text,538759456} \textdsversion{12} \template{messages} \excerptedcaption{Excerpts from internet.other.info-andrew: 10-Nov-92 Re: Postscript Printing Com.. Bob_Dew@alw.nih.gov (1673*)} \quotation{A drawback with WYSIWYG editors as you describe is that they require a }\quotation{binary format in which to store working drafts and editable document }\quotation{copies.} I don't really understand how WYSIWYG editing requires a binary format. Certainly in-core there will be some binary data whenever anything besides straight ASCII is being represented, currently styles are this way. I don't see any inherent features of WYSIWYG-ness which would require that we abandon our semi-readable datastream format. (I've taken a cursory look at frame's format... ugh 8K for "Hello World", in a custom document with nothing else...) \excerptedcaption{Excerpts from internet.other.info-andrew: 10-Nov-92 Re: Postscript Printing Com.. Bob_Dew@alw.nih.gov (1673*)} \quotation{I think one of the celebrated features that ATK offers over many (if not }\quotation{all) commercially available counterparts is that its intermediate data }\quotation{format is non-proprietary and ASCII readable.} Definitely. I think this is where ATK has an opportunity. If a reasonably complete WYSIWYG editor could be written in ATK I think it would be a very fine feather in our cap so to speak. Seen many free WYSIWYG editors? I'm not talking full function, but enough so that anything normally done with ez and troff looks right on screen. \excerptedcaption{Excerpts from internet.other.info-andrew: 10-Nov-92 Re: Postscript Printing Com.. Bob_Dew@alw.nih.gov (1673*)} \quotation{If I really wanted to use a WYSIWYG editor, I'd probably opt for }\quotation{something with a full range of formatting and typesetting capabilities, }\quotation{which in all likelihood would lie outside of what ATK could reasonably }\quotation{offer, and beyond what ATK has thus far been exemplary in providing. } True, I'm not sure we will have the time, man power or desire to produce a WYSIWYG editor. I hope that if we do go through with Postscript printing we can design the code from the beginning with a view towards a WYSIWYG editor or at least fast previewing. \excerptedcaption{Excerpts from internet.other.info-andrew: 10-Nov-92 Re: Postscript Printing Com.. Bob_Dew@alw.nih.gov (1673*)} \quotation{I think it would behoove project goals to investigate new text }\quotation{formatting ideas from the perspective of keeping data formats flexible, }\quotation{and as standard and as portable as possible. } Unfortunately ATK fails on 'standard', and depending on what type of portability you are considering it fails there to. It fails pretty badly on interchange with other editors. I believe currently the best path from EZ -> FrameMaker is via troff, of course this could be considered an argument in favor of staying with troff :-) (Unfortunately as might be expected it has some difficulty with the range of troff produced by ATK, and leaves a number of directives in the resulting frame document. This might make it less than useful.) This is actually the best argument I've heard for sticking with troff, but a one-way path to a proprietary format hardy encourages openness... Thanks for the input, -Rob Ryan Andrew Consortium \enddata{text,538759456} \enddata{text822, 28708} \begindata{text822, 33434} Return-path: X-Andrew-Authenticated-as: 0;andrew.cmu.edu;Network-Mail Received: from po4.andrew.cmu.edu via trymail for info-andrew+@andrew.cmu.edu (->+dist+/afs/andrew.cmu.edu/usr0/ak99/dists/info-andrew-nostrip.dl) ID ; Tue, 10 Nov 1992 08:48:19 -0500 (EST) Received: from po3.andrew.cmu.edu via qmail ID ; Tue, 10 Nov 1992 08:47:29 -0500 (EST) Received: from vnet.ibm.com by po3.andrew.cmu.edu (5.54/3.15) id for info-andrew+; Tue, 10 Nov 92 08:47:22 EST Received: from RCHLAND by vnet.ibm.com (IBM VM SMTP V2R2) with BSMTP id 4314; Tue, 10 Nov 92 08:45:14 EST Reply-To: "Todd Inglett" Received: by po1.rchland.ibm.com (5.51/4.7) id for info-andrew+@andrew.cmu.edu; Tue, 10 Nov 92 07:45:29 CST Received: via switchmail; Tue, 10 Nov 1992 07:45:28 -0600 (CST) Received: from q.rchland.ibm.com via qmail ID ; Tue, 10 Nov 1992 07:45:00 -0600 (CST) Received: from q.rchland.ibm.com via qmail ID ; Tue, 10 Nov 1992 07:44:57 -0600 (CST) Received: from Messages.8.5.N.CUILIB.3.45.SNAP.NOT.LINKED.q.rchland.ibm.com.rs.aix32 via MS.5.6.q.rchland.ibm.com.rs_aix32; Tue, 10 Nov 1992 07:44:55 -0600 (CST) Message-Id: Date: Tue, 10 Nov 1992 07:44:55 -0600 (CST) From: Todd Inglett X-Andrew-Message-Size: 4084+0 Content-Type: X-BE2; 12 If-Type-Unsupported: send To: Info-Andrew Subject: Re: Printers In-Reply-To: References: \begindata{text,538630088} \textdsversion{12} \template{messages} \excerptedcaption{Excerpts from ext.misc.info-andrew: 9-Nov-92 Printers Robert Andrew Ryan@andre (1030+0)} \quotation{I'm curious how many and what different Postscript interpreter versions are being used out there. Here we have one printer with interpreter version 38.0, and another reports 52.3 (Here the version is reported on the cover page, I'm not sure if that happens in general.) } We have printers with versions 47.0, 50.5, 52.3 and probably others, and ghostscript says it is version 54. I don't believe we have any printers before version 47.0 and if we do, I don't think we care about them. We could even cut out the 47.0 printers without a problem (I think we only have 3 of them). \excerptedcaption{Excerpts from ext.misc.info-andrew: 9-Nov-92 Re: Printers Bob_Dew@alw.nih.gov (388*)} \quotation{Aren't these dependencies necessary to support ATK's "preview"? } No, in fact I would prefer a postscript previewing program that uses ghostscript even for the current troff setup. This would allow drawings and rasters to be seen in the previewed document. I suppose the old preview could be retained as a speedy ``draft'' previewer as long as troff is still used. I believe ATK has all the functionality required to implement a ghostscript previewer--we just need someone with the time to do it. \excerptedcaption{Excerpts from ext.misc.info-andrew: 9-Nov-92 Re: Printers Bob_Dew@alw.nih.gov (388*)} \quotation{In the long run, I'd think a device-independent troff generator would be }\quotation{more useful and less error prone than a direct ATK-->Postscript program. } Obviously you've never had your fingers in txttroff.c :-). Not for the faint of heart! But I could read this comment another way...are you suggesting ATK produce troff dvi directly? How about TeX dvi? I am not sure what the win would be, other than more printer types would be supported. Of course ghostscript can be used to format postscript onto other printer types (albeit a bit slowly...but on an IBM 6000, ghostscript can drive a DeskJet 500 faster than many laser printers!). \excerptedcaption{Excerpts from ext.misc.info-andrew: 9-Nov-92 Postscript Printing Comment.. Robert Andrew Ryan@andre (2297+0)} \quotation{Perhaps it may be worthwhile for us to investigate another text formatter besides troff... } TeX and Lout are the only other formatters that come to mind as ``free.'' Are there others? TeX certainly falls in the ``is as complicated to build and install as groff'' category. Many universities already have it installed, so it would potentially be less of a problem than groff. Still, TeX is very big and relatively slow compared to ditroff. But in a one-on-one battle with ditroff, TeX would certainly win as more easy to maintain a ATK->formatter convertor. \excerptedcaption{Excerpts from ext.misc.info-andrew: 10-Nov-92 Re: Postscript Printing Com.. Bob_Dew@alw.nih.gov (1671*)} \quotation{I think one of the celebrated features that ATK offers over many (if not all) commercially available counterparts is that its intermediate data format is non-proprietary and ASCII readable. } I assume the datastream would not change at all...even if the document is displayed in WYSIWYG format. The only additions to the datastream would be new functions that cannot be currently implemented (text flows for multi-column output, physical page size, etc). I would imagine that a WYSIWYG view could be turned off so that the text can fill the window as efficiently as possible as it does today. I think a class similar to graphic (subclass of graphic) to render postscript would result in the biggest short term win. Many (most) ATK developers ignore printing because it is just too damn hard. Either you've got to know a lot about postscript to draw something, or you have to learn lots about troff and its ugly macros. And the fact that these insets are wired to either postscript or troff makes it even harder to change printing in the future! In the long run, ATK's printing has got to change. Troff just can't handle complicated things like references (i.e. see page xxx) and indexes. The current implementation is a great big hack. I would fear that TeX would simply change this to a little big hack. -todd inglett \enddata{text,538630088} \enddata{text822, 33434} \begindata{text822, 39770} Return-path: X-Andrew-Authenticated-as: 1210;alw.nih.gov;Bob Dew Received: from spot.dcrt.nih.gov via trymail for info-andrew+@andrew.cmu.edu (->+dist+/afs/andrew.cmu.edu/usr0/ak99/dists/info-andrew-nostrip.dl) (->+dist+/afs/andrew.cmu.edu/usr0/ak99/dists/info-andrew-nostrip.dl@andrew.cmu.edu) ID ; Tue, 10 Nov 1992 11:15:08 -0500 (EST) Received: from spot.dcrt.nih.gov via qmail ID ; Tue, 10 Nov 1992 11:14:42 -0500 (EST) If-Type-Unsupported: send Received: from spot.dcrt.nih.gov via qmail ID ; Tue, 10 Nov 1992 11:13:40 -0500 (EST) Received: from dude.dcrt.nih.gov via qmail ID ; Tue, 10 Nov 1992 11:13:01 -0500 (EST) Received: from dude.dcrt.nih.gov via qmail ID ; Tue, 10 Nov 1992 11:12:55 -0500 (EST) Received: from Messages.8.5.N.CUILIB.3.45.SNAP.NOT.LINKED.dude.dcrt.nih.gov.sun4c.411 via MS.5.6.dude.dcrt.nih.gov.sun4_41; Tue, 10 Nov 1992 11:12:55 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: Date: Tue, 10 Nov 1992 11:12:55 -0500 (EST) From: Bob_Dew@alw.nih.gov MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII To: Info-Andrew Subject: compchar question Is there any way to include the registered trademark symbol (capital R inside of a circle) in an ATK document? How about a superscripted TM? Thanks, -Bob \enddata{text822, 39770} \begindata{text822, 41551} Return-path: X-Andrew-Authenticated-as: 5904;andrew.cmu.edu;Robert Andrew Ryan Received: from atk.itc.cmu.edu via trymail for info-andrew+@andrew.cmu.edu (->+dist+/afs/andrew.cmu.edu/usr0/ak99/dists/info-andrew-nostrip.dl) ID ; Tue, 10 Nov 1992 11:59:38 -0500 (EST) Received: from atk.itc.cmu.edu via qmail ID ; Tue, 10 Nov 1992 11:57:45 -0500 (EST) Received: from Messages.8.5.N.CUILIB.3.45.SNAP.NOT.LINKED.atk.itc.cmu.edu.rs.aix31 via MS.5.6.atk.itc.cmu.edu.rs_aix31; Tue, 10 Nov 1992 11:57:44 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: Date: Tue, 10 Nov 1992 11:57:44 -0500 (EST) From: Robert Andrew Ryan X-Andrew-Message-Size: 585+0 Content-Type: X-BE2; 12 If-Type-Unsupported: send To: Info-Andrew Subject: Re: compchar question In-Reply-To: References: \begindata{text,538655280} \textdsversion{12} \template{messages} \excerptedcaption{Excerpts from internet.other.info-andrew: 10-Nov-92 compchar question Bob_Dew@alw.nih.gov (158*)} \quotation{Is there any way to include the registered trademark symbol (capital R }\quotation{inside of a circle) in an ATK document?} Yes, the rg composition should be what you want. (Assuming the font being used has ISO-latin-1 characters.) \excerptedcaption{Excerpts from internet.other.info-andrew: 10-Nov-92 compchar question Bob_Dew@alw.nih.gov (158*)} \quotation{How about a superscripted TM? } I don't see it anywhere, you'll probably have to make do with superscripting a small tm like:A\superscript{\smaller{\smaller{TM }}}(superscript smaller smaller) -Rob \enddata{text,538655280} \enddata{text822, 41551} \begindata{text822, 43519} Return-path: X-Andrew-Authenticated-as: 0;andrew.cmu.edu;Network-Mail Received: from andrew.cmu.edu via trymail for info-andrew+@andrew.cmu.edu (->+dist+/afs/andrew.cmu.edu/usr0/ak99/dists/info-andrew-nostrip.dl) ID ; Tue, 10 Nov 1992 13:41:32 -0500 (EST) Received: from po5.andrew.cmu.edu via qmail ID ; Tue, 10 Nov 1992 13:38:25 -0500 (EST) Received: from sadye.emba.uvm.edu by po5.andrew.cmu.edu (5.54/3.15) id for info-andrew+; Tue, 10 Nov 92 13:38:04 EST Received: by sadye.emba.uvm.edu id AA28808 (5.65/6.02); Tue, 10 Nov 92 13:37:49 -0500 Date: Tue, 10 Nov 92 13:37:49 -0500 From: Garrett.Wollman@UVM.EDU Message-Id: <9211101837.AA28808@sadye.emba.uvm.edu> To: "Todd Inglett" Cc: Info-Andrew Subject: Re: Printers In-Reply-To: References: < said: > I think a class similar to graphic (subclass of graphic) to render > postscript would result in the biggest short term win. This should actually be a fairly quick hack, if you are willing to depend on ghostscript. Just create a pixmap or window on the X server, and set the enviornment variable GHOSTVIEW to be either the window ID, or the window ID and the pixmap ID. Then fire up ghostscript with the PostScript code as standard input, and away we go. There's actually a bit more to it than that, but that's the basic idea. This is documented in ghostview-1.4/gs.interface, for anyone interested in actually doing it. -GAWollman -- Garrett A. Wollman | Shashish is simple, it's discreet, it's brief. ... wollman@emba.uvm.edu | Shashish is the bonding of hearts in spite of distance. uvm-gen!wollman | It is a bond more powerful than absence. We like people UVM disagrees. | who like Shashish. - Claude McKenzie + Florent Vollant \enddata{text822, 43519} \begindata{text822, 45746} Return-path: X-Andrew-Authenticated-as: 0;andrew.cmu.edu;Network-Mail Received: from po5.andrew.cmu.edu via trymail for info-andrew+@andrew.cmu.edu (->+dist+/afs/andrew.cmu.edu/usr0/ak99/dists/info-andrew-nostrip.dl) ID ; Tue, 10 Nov 1992 13:55:27 -0500 (EST) Received: from po3.andrew.cmu.edu via qmail ID ; Tue, 10 Nov 1992 13:54:08 -0500 (EST) Received: from vnet.ibm.com by po3.andrew.cmu.edu (5.54/3.15) id for info-andrew+; Tue, 10 Nov 92 13:53:48 EST Received: from RCHLAND by vnet.ibm.com (IBM VM SMTP V2R2) with BSMTP id 1484; Tue, 10 Nov 92 13:51:39 EST Reply-To: "Todd Inglett" Received: by po1.rchland.ibm.com (5.51/4.7) id for info-andrew+@andrew.cmu.edu; Tue, 10 Nov 92 12:52:54 CST Received: via switchmail; Tue, 10 Nov 1992 12:52:53 -0600 (CST) Received: from q.rchland.ibm.com via qmail ID ; Tue, 10 Nov 1992 12:52:28 -0600 (CST) Received: from q.rchland.ibm.com via qmail ID ; Tue, 10 Nov 1992 12:52:27 -0600 (CST) Received: from Messages.8.5.N.CUILIB.3.45.SNAP.NOT.LINKED.q.rchland.ibm.com.rs.aix32 via MS.5.6.q.rchland.ibm.com.rs_aix32; Tue, 10 Nov 1992 12:52:26 -0600 (CST) Message-Id: Date: Tue, 10 Nov 1992 12:52:26 -0600 (CST) From: Todd Inglett X-Andrew-Message-Size: 394+0 Content-Type: X-BE2; 12 If-Type-Unsupported: send To: Info-Andrew Subject: Re: compchar question In-Reply-To: References: \begindata{text,538961624} \textdsversion{12} \template{messages} \excerptedcaption{Excerpts from ext.misc.info-andrew: 10-Nov-92 compchar question Bob_Dew@alw.nih.gov (158*)} \quotation{Is there any way to include the registered trademark symbol (capital R }\quotation{inside of a circle) in an ATK document? How about a superscripted TM? } I use \^{.} for registered (^X x r g) and just a superscripted tm for the \superscript{tm}. Do they show up for you? You might also want to test printing them. -todd inglett \enddata{text,538961624} \enddata{text822, 45746} \begindata{text822, 48274} Return-path: X-Andrew-Authenticated-as: 0;andrew.cmu.edu;Network-Mail Received: from po2.andrew.cmu.edu via trymail for info-andrew+@andrew.cmu.edu (->+dist+/afs/andrew.cmu.edu/usr0/ak99/dists/info-andrew-nostrip.dl) ID ; Tue, 10 Nov 1992 14:15:32 -0500 (EST) Received: from po3.andrew.cmu.edu via qmail ID ; Tue, 10 Nov 1992 14:13:29 -0500 (EST) Received: from vnet.ibm.com by po3.andrew.cmu.edu (5.54/3.15) id for info-andrew+; Tue, 10 Nov 92 14:05:50 EST Received: from RCHLAND by vnet.ibm.com (IBM VM SMTP V2R2) with BSMTP id 1729; Tue, 10 Nov 92 14:03:13 EST Reply-To: "Todd Inglett" Received: by po1.rchland.ibm.com (5.51/4.7) id for info-andrew+@andrew.cmu.edu; Tue, 10 Nov 92 13:02:07 CST Received: via switchmail; Tue, 10 Nov 1992 13:02:06 -0600 (CST) Received: from q.rchland.ibm.com via qmail ID ; Tue, 10 Nov 1992 13:01:41 -0600 (CST) Received: from q.rchland.ibm.com via qmail ID ; Tue, 10 Nov 1992 13:01:40 -0600 (CST) Received: from Messages.8.5.N.CUILIB.3.45.SNAP.NOT.LINKED.q.rchland.ibm.com.rs.aix32 via MS.5.6.q.rchland.ibm.com.rs_aix32; Tue, 10 Nov 1992 13:01:39 -0600 (CST) Message-Id: Date: Tue, 10 Nov 1992 13:01:39 -0600 (CST) From: Todd Inglett X-Andrew-Message-Size: 1297+0 Content-Type: X-BE2; 12 If-Type-Unsupported: send To: Info-Andrew Subject: Re: Printers In-Reply-To: <9211101837.AA28808@sadye.emba.uvm.edu> References: <9211101837.AA28808@sadye.emba.uvm.edu> \begindata{text,538961624} \textdsversion{12} \template{messages} \excerptedcaption{Excerpts from ext.misc.info-andrew: 10-Nov-92 Re: Printers Garrett.Wollman@UVM.EDU (1047)} \quotation{This should actually be a fairly quick hack, if you are willing to }\quotation{depend on ghostscript. Just create a pixmap or window on the X }\quotation{server, and set the enviornment variable GHOSTVIEW} Actually, this is what I had in mind for implemented an ATK version of a postscript previewer. It would use ghostscript to render the postscript in a window, but otherwise would provide an ATK interface consistent with ez. If the X server supports display postscript, that can be used instead. Let me clarify my comments about a postscript graphics class. What I would like is a class that could render a drawing in some kind of abstract ``page'' (not necessarily a full page) much like graphic renders bits in a window. Then my inset can generate a rectanglar drawing that the text in which it is embedded can put somewhere in its physical output page. A postscript implementation would probably use encapsulated postscript to do this. However, it could be subclassed for other implementations (HPGL for example) as graphic could have different implementations. It could also be subclassed to produce conversions to other document formats (Framemaker, TeX, etc) provided the function is high level. -todd inglett \enddata{text,538961624} \enddata{text822, 48274} \begindata{text822, 51782} Return-path: X-Andrew-Authenticated-as: 5904;andrew.cmu.edu;Robert Andrew Ryan Received: from atk.itc.cmu.edu via trymail for info-andrew+@andrew.cmu.edu (->+dist+/afs/andrew.cmu.edu/usr0/ak99/dists/info-andrew-nostrip.dl) ID ; Tue, 10 Nov 1992 14:22:45 -0500 (EST) Received: from atk.itc.cmu.edu via qmail ID ; Tue, 10 Nov 1992 14:22:03 -0500 (EST) Received: from Messages.8.5.N.CUILIB.3.45.SNAP.NOT.LINKED.atk.itc.cmu.edu.rs.aix31 via MS.5.6.atk.itc.cmu.edu.rs_aix31; Tue, 10 Nov 1992 14:22:03 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: Date: Tue, 10 Nov 1992 14:22:03 -0500 (EST) From: Robert Andrew Ryan To: Info-Andrew Subject: Re: Printers CC: Info-Andrew In-Reply-To: <9211101837.AA28808@sadye.emba.uvm.edu> References: <9211101837.AA28808@sadye.emba.uvm.edu> Excerpts from internet.other.info-andrew: 10-Nov-92 Re: Printers Garrett.Wollman@UVM.EDU (1049) > < said: > > I think a class similar to graphic (subclass of graphic) to render > > postscript would result in the biggest short term win. > This should actually be a fairly quick hack, if you are willing to depend on ghostscript. I think you've slightly misunderstood the proposal (though what you say is correct given the misunderstanding.) I believe the concept Todd Inglett is speaking of is that there be another subclass of graphic (and probably view) which would allow any existing ATK view to be printed simply by inserting it under a special view, and requesting a full update. The result of which would be a batch of postscript for drawing the view. This will probably be part of the system if we do go through with direct postscript printing. Excerpts from internet.other.info-andrew: 10-Nov-92 Re: Printers Garrett.Wollman@UVM.EDU (1049) > Just create a pixmap or window on the X server, and set the enviornment > variable GHOSTVIEW to be either the window ID, or the window ID and the > pixmap ID. Then fire up ghostscript with the PostScript code as > standard input, and away we go. I actually had the quick hack done once, unfortunately I was not satisfied with the requirement that I have one gs process per ps inset (also the ability to tell gs what area of the window to use would be a big help). I've been meaning to send the Ghostscript folks my wish list for awhile now... (Another approach would be to have gs use it's backing pixmap, and never map it's window..., then just xcopyare from it's pixmap onto the view.) Unfortunately all of this violates the concept of window system independence. (It could be preserved if we used the pbm device, but that would mean putting the images out over the wire to the X or WM server.) -Rob \enddata{text822, 51782} \begindata{text822, 54953} Return-path: X-Andrew-Authenticated-as: 0;andrew.cmu.edu;Network-Mail Received: from andrew.cmu.edu via trymail for info-andrew+@andrew.cmu.edu (->+dist+/afs/andrew.cmu.edu/usr0/ak99/dists/info-andrew-nostrip.dl) ID ; Tue, 10 Nov 1992 15:01:31 -0500 (EST) Received: from po2.andrew.cmu.edu via qmail ID ; Tue, 10 Nov 1992 14:59:42 -0500 (EST) Received: from ucbvax.Berkeley.EDU by po2.andrew.cmu.edu (5.54/3.15) id for info-andrew; Tue, 10 Nov 92 14:59:11 EST Received: by ucbvax.Berkeley.EDU (5.63/1.43) id AA11327; Tue, 10 Nov 92 11:53:58 -0800 Received: from USENET by ucbvax.Berkeley.EDU with netnews for info-andrew@andrew.cmu.edu (info-andrew@andrew.cmu.edu) (contact usenet@ucbvax.Berkeley.EDU if you have questions) Date: 9 Nov 92 13:17:49 GMT From: pipex!warwick!uknet!comlab.ox.ac.uk!mikes@uunet.uu.net (Mike Smith) Organization: Department of Biochemistry, University of Oxford Subject: Building Andrew on a Silicon Graphics Message-Id: <1992Nov9.131749.961@newton.bioch.ox.ac.uk> Sender: info-andrew-request@andrew.cmu.edu To: info-andrew@andrew.cmu.edu I would like some help with building the andrew software on my Silicon Graphics which is running 4.0.5. Everything is (or should be) in the standard places. This is as far as I get ... cc -G 0 -cckr -c -O -I. -I/usr/andrew/include/atk -I/usr/andrew/include -I/usr/include -DSYSV -D_BSD_SIGNALS doload.c cpp: error /usr/include/syms.h:113: Can't find include file cmplrs/stsupport.h I have to admit that I haven't altered the files config/site.h and config/site.mcr, but I can't work out what (if anything) I need to do here. Any help anyone? Many Thanks Mike Smith \enddata{text822, 54953} \begindata{text822, 56872} Return-path: X-Andrew-Authenticated-as: 0;andrew.cmu.edu;Network-Mail Received: from po5.andrew.cmu.edu via trymail for info-andrew+@andrew.cmu.edu (->+dist+/afs/andrew.cmu.edu/usr0/ak99/dists/info-andrew-nostrip.dl) ID ; Tue, 10 Nov 1992 18:20:42 -0500 (EST) Received: from po3.andrew.cmu.edu via qmail ID ; Tue, 10 Nov 1992 18:18:38 -0500 (EST) Received: from alpha.xerox.com by po3.andrew.cmu.edu (5.54/3.15) id for rr2b; Tue, 10 Nov 92 18:18:25 EST Received: from holmes.parc.xerox.com ([13.1.100.162]) by alpha.xerox.com with SMTP id <12330>; Tue, 10 Nov 1992 15:18:09 PST Received: by holmes.parc.xerox.com id <25546>; Tue, 10 Nov 1992 15:17:00 -0800 Received: from Messages.7.15.N.CUILIB.3.45.SNAP.NOT.LINKED.holmes.parc.xerox.com.sun4.41 via MS.5.6.holmes.parc.xerox.com.sun4_41; Tue, 10 Nov 1992 15:16:54 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: Date: Tue, 10 Nov 1992 15:16:54 PST Sender: Bill Janssen From: Bill Janssen To: Info-Andrew , Robert Andrew Ryan , Bob_Dew@alw.nih.gov Subject: Re: Postscript Printing Comments? (was) Re: Printers In-Reply-To: References: I think Bob's comments here are right on the mark. Bill \enddata{text822, 56872} \begindata{text822, 58599} Return-path: X-Andrew-Authenticated-as: 0;andrew.cmu.edu;Network-Mail Received: from po2.andrew.cmu.edu via trymail for info-andrew+@andrew.cmu.edu (->+dist+/afs/andrew.cmu.edu/usr0/ak99/dists/info-andrew-nostrip.dl) ID ; Tue, 10 Nov 1992 18:23:12 -0500 (EST) Received: from po3.andrew.cmu.edu via qmail ID ; Tue, 10 Nov 1992 18:22:22 -0500 (EST) Received: from alpha.xerox.com by po3.andrew.cmu.edu (5.54/3.15) id for rr2b+; Tue, 10 Nov 92 18:22:07 EST Received: from holmes.parc.xerox.com ([13.1.100.162]) by alpha.xerox.com with SMTP id <12325>; Tue, 10 Nov 1992 15:21:50 PST Received: by holmes.parc.xerox.com id <25546>; Tue, 10 Nov 1992 15:21:46 -0800 Received: from Messages.7.15.N.CUILIB.3.45.SNAP.NOT.LINKED.holmes.parc.xerox.com.sun4.41 via MS.5.6.holmes.parc.xerox.com.sun4_41; Tue, 10 Nov 1992 15:21:32 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: Date: Tue, 10 Nov 1992 15:21:32 PST Sender: Bill Janssen From: Bill Janssen To: Info-Andrew , Robert Andrew Ryan Subject: Re: Postscript Printing Comments? (was) Re: Printers In-Reply-To: References: Excerpts from ext.andrew: 10-Nov-92 Re: Postscript Printing Com.. Robert Andrew Ryan@andre (3037+0) > Definitely. I think this is where ATK has an opportunity. If a > reasonably complete WYSIWYG editor could be written in ATK I think it > would be a very fine feather in our cap so to speak. Seen many free > WYSIWYG editors? I'm not talking full function, but enough so that > anything normally done with ez and troff looks right on screen. I think this is a real red herring and a good way to sink your consortium by adding useless work. With ports of MS Word and FrameMaker to Macs, PCs, and X, there's no way EZ is going to be able to compete in terms of WYSIWYG functionality. The niche that EZ has is based on simple multi-media support, and being NON-wysiwyg -- that is, displaying a document based on the right way of displaying it for the context, rather than trying to force everything in the world into being a piece of paper. Concentrate on What-You-See-Looks-Good-For-Your-Display-Context (WYSLGFYDC?). Bill \enddata{text822, 58599} \begindata{text822, 61323} Return-path: X-Andrew-Authenticated-as: 0;andrew.cmu.edu;Network-Mail Received: from andrew.cmu.edu via trymail for info-andrew+@andrew.cmu.edu (->+dist+/afs/andrew.cmu.edu/usr0/ak99/dists/info-andrew-nostrip.dl) ID ; Tue, 10 Nov 1992 18:25:21 -0500 (EST) Received: from po3.andrew.cmu.edu via qmail ID ; Tue, 10 Nov 1992 18:24:12 -0500 (EST) Received: from alpha.xerox.com by po3.andrew.cmu.edu (5.54/3.15) id for info-andrew+; Tue, 10 Nov 92 18:24:01 EST Received: from holmes.parc.xerox.com ([13.1.100.162]) by alpha.xerox.com with SMTP id <12325>; Tue, 10 Nov 1992 15:23:41 PST Received: by holmes.parc.xerox.com id <25546>; Tue, 10 Nov 1992 15:23:34 -0800 Received: from Messages.7.15.N.CUILIB.3.45.SNAP.NOT.LINKED.holmes.parc.xerox.com.sun4.41 via MS.5.6.holmes.parc.xerox.com.sun4_41; Tue, 10 Nov 1992 15:23:23 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: Date: Tue, 10 Nov 1992 15:23:23 PST Sender: Bill Janssen From: Bill Janssen X-Andrew-Message-Size: 618+0 Content-Type: X-BE2; 12 If-Type-Unsupported: send To: Info-Andrew , "Todd Inglett" Subject: Re: Printers In-Reply-To: References: <9211101837.AA28808@sadye.emba.uvm.edu> \begindata{text,2532752} \textdsversion{12} \template{messages} \define{global } \excerptedcaption{Excerpts from ext.andrew: 10-Nov-92 Re: Printers Todd Inglett@rchland.ibm (1297+0)} \quotation{\quotation{This should actually be a fairly quick hack, if you are willing to }}\quotation{\quotation{depend on ghostscript. Just create a pixmap or window on the X }}\quotation{\quotation{server, and set the enviornment variable GHOSTVIEW} } \quotation{Actually, this is what I had in mind for implemented an ATK version of a postscript previewer. It would use ghostscript to render the postscript in a window, but otherwise would provide an ATK interface consistent with ez. If the X server supports display postscript, that can be used instead. } Yes, I've written one of these. Not too hard. Bill \enddata{text,2532752} \enddata{text822, 61323} \begindata{text822, 63869} Return-path: X-Andrew-Authenticated-as: 0;andrew.cmu.edu;Network-Mail Received: from po4.andrew.cmu.edu via trymail for info-andrew+@andrew.cmu.edu (->+dist+/afs/andrew.cmu.edu/usr0/ak99/dists/info-andrew-nostrip.dl) ID ; Tue, 10 Nov 1992 18:25:45 -0500 (EST) Received: from po3.andrew.cmu.edu via qmail ID ; Tue, 10 Nov 1992 18:23:01 -0500 (EST) Received: from alpha.xerox.com by po3.andrew.cmu.edu (5.54/3.15) id for info-andrew+; Tue, 10 Nov 92 18:22:58 EST Received: from holmes.parc.xerox.com ([13.1.100.162]) by alpha.xerox.com with SMTP id <12335>; Tue, 10 Nov 1992 15:22:40 PST Received: by holmes.parc.xerox.com id <25546>; Tue, 10 Nov 1992 15:22:32 -0800 Received: from Messages.7.15.N.CUILIB.3.45.SNAP.NOT.LINKED.holmes.parc.xerox.com.sun4.41 via MS.5.6.holmes.parc.xerox.com.sun4_41; Tue, 10 Nov 1992 15:22:27 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: Date: Tue, 10 Nov 1992 15:22:27 PST Sender: Bill Janssen From: Bill Janssen X-Andrew-Message-Size: 423+0 Content-Type: X-BE2; 12 If-Type-Unsupported: send To: Info-Andrew , "Todd Inglett" Subject: Re: Printers In-Reply-To: References: \begindata{text,2532752} \textdsversion{12} \template{messages} \define{global } \excerptedcaption{Excerpts from ext.andrew: 10-Nov-92 Re: Printers Todd Inglett@rchland.ibm (4084+0)} \quotation{\quotation{Aren't these dependencies necessary to support ATK's "preview"? }} \quotation{No, in fact I would prefer a postscript previewing program that uses ghostscript even for the current troff setup. This would allow drawings and rasters to be seen in the previewed document. } Yes, in fact I use ghostview as my preview tool for printed ATK documents. Bill \enddata{text,2532752} \enddata{text822, 63869} \begindata{text822, 66093} Return-path: X-Andrew-Authenticated-as: 5904;andrew.cmu.edu;Robert Andrew Ryan Received: from atk.itc.cmu.edu via trymail for info-andrew+@andrew.cmu.edu (->+dist+/afs/andrew.cmu.edu/usr0/ak99/dists/info-andrew-nostrip.dl) ID ; Tue, 10 Nov 1992 19:25:14 -0500 (EST) Received: from atk.itc.cmu.edu via qmail ID ; Tue, 10 Nov 1992 19:23:26 -0500 (EST) Received: from Messages.8.5.N.CUILIB.3.45.SNAP.NOT.LINKED.atk.itc.cmu.edu.rs.aix31 via MS.5.6.atk.itc.cmu.edu.rs_aix31; Tue, 10 Nov 1992 19:23:26 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: Date: Tue, 10 Nov 1992 19:23:26 -0500 (EST) From: Robert Andrew Ryan To: Info-Andrew , Bill Janssen Subject: Re: Postscript Printing Comments? (was) Re: Printers In-Reply-To: References: Excerpts from mail: 10-Nov-92 Re: Postscript Printing Com.. Bill Janssen@parc.xerox. (1032) > I think this is a real red herring and a good way to sink your consortium by adding useless work. Do you consider ATK to Postscript printing to be in the red herring category as well? -Rob \enddata{text822, 66093} \begindata{text822, 67743} Return-path: X-Andrew-Authenticated-as: 0;andrew.cmu.edu;Network-Mail Received: from po5.andrew.cmu.edu via trymail for info-andrew+@andrew.cmu.edu (->+dist+/afs/andrew.cmu.edu/usr0/ak99/dists/info-andrew-nostrip.dl) ID ; Tue, 10 Nov 1992 20:42:21 -0500 (EST) Received: from po3.andrew.cmu.edu via qmail ID ; Tue, 10 Nov 1992 20:40:42 -0500 (EST) Received: from alpha.xerox.com by po3.andrew.cmu.edu (5.54/3.15) id for info-andrew; Tue, 10 Nov 92 20:40:25 EST Received: from holmes.parc.xerox.com ([13.1.100.162]) by alpha.xerox.com with SMTP id <12384>; Tue, 10 Nov 1992 17:40:11 PST Received: by holmes.parc.xerox.com id <25546>; Tue, 10 Nov 1992 17:39:58 -0800 Received: from Messages.7.15.N.CUILIB.3.45.SNAP.NOT.LINKED.holmes.parc.xerox.com.sun4.41 via MS.5.6.holmes.parc.xerox.com.sun4_41; Tue, 10 Nov 1992 17:39:52 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: Date: Tue, 10 Nov 1992 17:39:52 PST Sender: Bill Janssen From: Bill Janssen To: Robert Andrew Ryan Subject: Re: Postscript Printing Comments? (was) Re: Printers Cc: info-andrew@andrew.cmu.edu In-Reply-To: References: No, of course not, Rob. PS is well suited for many tasks, particularly the description of pictures. I am quite a fan of the combined approach of groff+EPS, particularly since Jim Clark is apparently willing to contribute some effort in making it work. I'd replace the dvi previewer with the ghostview supplied with ghostscript 2.5 (which has a pretty groty UI; better perhaps to supply an ATK version of ghostview using the ghostview protocols to talk to ghostscript). But bear in mind that printing is not everything; there are places where the display on the screen is more important. My recommendation would be to focus on other features that have bugs, and on places where ATK shines. In the first category, footnotes, templates, and citations come to mind. The footnote styles are very fragile. The citation system is broken completely. Color images are needed. It is difficult to use one document as a template for another. In the second category, hypertext and active documents are major contributions to the technology available via ATK, as is the notion of mapping a persistent typed object system onto the normal file system (via the dataobject storage methods). I'd like to see the `text' class turned into a `hypertext' class in a totally backward-compatible way, via the addition of Universal Resource Identifiers currently being discussed in the IETF, and the notions of anchors with links. Adding a synchronized document, to allow multiple streams of timestamped input to be synchronized, would be an interesting and original contribution. Bill \enddata{text822, 67743} \begindata{text822, 71076} Return-path: X-Andrew-Authenticated-as: 0;andrew.cmu.edu;Network-Mail Received: from po2.andrew.cmu.edu via trymail for info-andrew+@andrew.cmu.edu (->+dist+/afs/andrew.cmu.edu/usr0/ak99/dists/info-andrew-nostrip.dl) ID ; Wed, 11 Nov 1992 16:50:47 -0500 (EST) Received: from po3.andrew.cmu.edu via qmail ID ; Wed, 11 Nov 1992 16:48:44 -0500 (EST) Received: from vnet.ibm.com by po3.andrew.cmu.edu (5.54/3.15) id for info-andrew; Wed, 11 Nov 92 16:48:27 EST Received: from RCHLAND by vnet.ibm.com (IBM VM SMTP V2R2) with BSMTP id 8535; Wed, 11 Nov 92 16:46:20 EST Reply-To: "Todd Inglett" Received: by po1.rchland.ibm.com (5.51/4.7) id for info-andrew@andrew.cmu.edu; Wed, 11 Nov 92 15:47:35 CST Received: via switchmail; Wed, 11 Nov 1992 15:47:34 -0600 (CST) Received: from q.rchland.ibm.com via qmail ID ; Wed, 11 Nov 1992 15:45:06 -0600 (CST) Received: from q.rchland.ibm.com via qmail ID ; Wed, 11 Nov 1992 15:45:05 -0600 (CST) Received: from Messages.8.5.N.CUILIB.3.45.SNAP.NOT.LINKED.q.rchland.ibm.com.rs.aix32 via MS.5.6.q.rchland.ibm.com.rs_aix32; Wed, 11 Nov 1992 15:45:02 -0600 (CST) Message-Id: Date: Wed, 11 Nov 1992 15:45:02 -0600 (CST) From: Todd Inglett X-Andrew-Message-Size: 2922+1 Content-Type: X-BE2; 12 If-Type-Unsupported: send To: rr2b@andrew.cmu.edu, Bob_Dew@alw.nih.gov Subject: Re: Postscript Printing Comments? Cc: info-andrew@andrew.cmu.edu In-Reply-To: References: \begindata{text,538629928} \textdsversion{12} \template{messages} \define{footnote attr:[Flags OverBar Int Set] attr:[FontSize PreviousFontSize Point -2]} \excerptedcaption{Excerpts from mail: 11-Nov-92 Postscript Printing Comment.. Bob_Dew@alw.nih.gov (825*)} \quotation{Maybe I'm missing something } Yes, I think you are making the assumption that ez will save the postscript or some equivalent as its datastream. I would hope that the only significant difference between a WYSIWYGview and the current textview is that the WYSIWYGview would show the file as it would be printed. That is, it would show the file with a horizontal scrollbar (if necessary), it would show lines dividing the pages, and it would show physical margins on each side of the text. However, ez would \italic{compute} each page's physical appearance, including page breaks, on the fly. This information would not be stored in the datastream because it can always be recomputed.\footnote{\ \begindata{fnote,538876072} \textdsversion{12} Some hints might be saved to speed up redisplay.\ \enddata{fnote,538876072} \view{fnotev,538876072,0,0,0}} I would expect you could edit the file with the old ez, and then bring it up in the new ez without a problem. In fact, it should be possible to toggle back and forth between what Bill calls WYSLGFYDC (the current ez method) and WYSIWYG! Of course a true WYSIWYGview would optionally enhance the datastream a little. This would be a true subclass of \italic{text} and therefore not backward compatible. For example, a \italic{wysiwyg} data object would probably want to store the physical page size and margins in the datastream. Then ez will know how big the page is when it regenerates the document as you edit it. More advanced features would include text flows (rectangular regions on the page, and their interconnections) which also must be saved. Text flows would include only the physical or relative locations of the text flows on the page. A wysiwyg data object can either compute what text belongs in the flow, or save hints to remember that text. The datastream will still be similar to what we know and love, and hopefully be mailable too. What about insets that generate postscript directly? A wysywyg dataobject would allocate a phyiscal rectangle where the inset will draw. This rectangle will match exactly what will be printed. It is up to the inset to guarantee that it's generated postscript will print exactly as shown on screen. Obviously some insets might need a little cleanup. I do not think that the presence of WYSIWYG in ez means that the old method of editing will be dead. Certainly, when I compose or read mail I want messages to flow the text as efficiently as possible. I would also use the old method when editing many (most?) documents that I don't commonly print (i.e. on-line help). However, Bill Jensen has a good question: should we waste time on WYSIWYG? There are other aspects of Andrew that can use some enhancement. But printing has always been a problem, and I would like to see it get a little better. Does it need to be WYSIWYG? No, but if enhancements are made (like direct to postscript printing), it would be nice if a little groundwork were laid that would make it possible in the future. -todd inglett \enddata{text,538629928} \enddata{text822, 71076} \begindata{text822, 76504} Return-path: X-Andrew-Authenticated-as: 0;andrew.cmu.edu;Network-Mail Received: from po5.andrew.cmu.edu via trymail for info-andrew+@andrew.cmu.edu (->+dist+/afs/andrew.cmu.edu/usr0/ak99/dists/info-andrew-nostrip.dl) ID ; Wed, 11 Nov 1992 18:48:48 -0500 (EST) Received: from po5.andrew.cmu.edu via qmail ID ; Wed, 11 Nov 1992 18:47:40 -0500 (EST) Received: from ucbvax.Berkeley.EDU by po5.andrew.cmu.edu (5.54/3.15) id for info-andrew; Wed, 11 Nov 92 18:47:23 EST Received: by ucbvax.Berkeley.EDU (5.63/1.43) id AA29016; Wed, 11 Nov 92 15:44:39 -0800 Received: from USENET by ucbvax.Berkeley.EDU with netnews for info-andrew@andrew.cmu.edu (info-andrew@andrew.cmu.edu) (contact usenet@ucbvax.Berkeley.EDU if you have questions) Date: 9 Nov 92 19:13:05 GMT From: cis.ohio-state.edu!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!sol.ctr.columbia.edu!ira.uka.de!chx400!sicsun!disuns2!disuns2.epfl.ch!simon@ucbvax.Berkeley.EDU (Simon Leinen) Organization: DI-LIA -- Ecole Polytechnique Federale de Lausanne Subject: Re: Building Andrew on a Silicon Graphics Message-Id: References: <1992Nov9.131749.961@newton.bioch.ox.ac.uk> Sender: info-andrew-request@andrew.cmu.edu To: info-andrew@andrew.cmu.edu In article <1992Nov9.131749.961@newton.bioch.ox.ac.uk> mikes@bioch.ox.ac.uk (Mike Smith) writes: cc -G 0 -cckr -c -O -I. -I/usr/andrew/include/atk -I/usr/andrew/include -I/usr/include -DSYSV -D_BSD_SIGNALS doload.c cpp: error /usr/include/syms.h:113: Can't find include file cmplrs/stsupport.h This means that you should install the IRIX subsystem "dev.complrs_hdr.internal" (Base Compiler Internal Headers). I think you also need this if you want to compile GNU CC. Hope this helps, -- Simon. \enddata{text822, 76504} \begindata{text822, 78494} Return-path: X-Andrew-Authenticated-as: 0;andrew.cmu.edu;Network-Mail Received: from andrew.cmu.edu via trymail for info-andrew+@andrew.cmu.edu (->+dist+/afs/andrew.cmu.edu/usr0/ak99/dists/info-andrew-nostrip.dl) ID ; Wed, 11 Nov 1992 19:03:27 -0500 (EST) Received: from po5.andrew.cmu.edu via qmail ID ; Wed, 11 Nov 1992 19:02:19 -0500 (EST) Received: from ucbvax.Berkeley.EDU by po5.andrew.cmu.edu (5.54/3.15) id for info-andrew; Wed, 11 Nov 92 19:01:55 EST Received: by ucbvax.Berkeley.EDU (5.63/1.43) id AA29586; Wed, 11 Nov 92 15:56:57 -0800 Received: from USENET by ucbvax.Berkeley.EDU with netnews for info-andrew@andrew.cmu.edu (info-andrew@andrew.cmu.edu) (contact usenet@ucbvax.Berkeley.EDU if you have questions) Date: 11 Nov 92 09:46:17 GMT From: eru.mt.luth.se!lunic!sunic!news.funet.fi!fuug!atomica!dag@bloom-beacon.mit.edu (Dag Nygren) Organization: Oy Atomica Ab, ESBO, FINLAND Subject: Making a hyperlink running another program ? Message-Id: <1992Nov11.094617.15591@atomica.fi> Sender: info-andrew-request@andrew.cmu.edu To: info-andrew@andrew.cmu.edu Hi there netters, is there a way of using pushbuttons to run other programs from a ez document? Even if Andrew is quite a good tool I have a lot of tgif documents here that in a sensible way should be linked to my other documentation. And I still need a roff-link include feature for my ever changing tables. Am I using the wrong tool for doing my documentation here or is there someone out there an answer ? -- Dag Nygren email: dag@atomica.fi Oy Atomica Ab or santra!atomica!dag Box 22 (Ahventie 4A) 02170 Esbo \enddata{text822, 78494} \begindata{text822, 80368} Return-path: X-Andrew-Authenticated-as: 0;andrew.cmu.edu;Network-Mail Received: from po2.andrew.cmu.edu via trymail for info-andrew+@andrew.cmu.edu (->+dist+/afs/andrew.cmu.edu/usr0/ak99/dists/info-andrew-nostrip.dl) ID ; Thu, 12 Nov 1992 02:37:24 -0500 (EST) Received: from po5.andrew.cmu.edu via qmail ID ; Thu, 12 Nov 1992 02:36:49 -0500 (EST) Received: from MIT.EDU (MIT.MIT.EDU) by po5.andrew.cmu.edu (5.54/3.15) id for info-andrew+; Thu, 12 Nov 92 02:36:34 EST Received: from HEYOKA.MIT.EDU by MIT.EDU with SMTP id AA21354; Thu, 12 Nov 92 02:36:26 EST Received: by heyoka.MIT.EDU (4.1/4.7) id AA08648; Thu, 12 Nov 92 02:35:59 EST Received: from Messages.7.15.N.CUILIB.3.45.SNAP.NOT.LINKED.heyoka.noname.sun4.41 via MS.5.6.heyoka.noname.sun4_41; Thu, 12 Nov 1992 02:35:58 -0500 (EST) Message-Id: Date: Thu, 12 Nov 1992 02:35:58 -0500 (EST) From: Bill Cattey To: info-andrew+@andrew.cmu.edu Subject: Who else has ez printing with groff. I finally bit the bullet and compiled up groff (and gcc and g++ and bison and libg++). I have successfully printed ez documents on my HP Laserjet IIP+ with Pacific Datasystems PostScript. BUT: All the pages are shifted up an inch so no page numbers are visible. The speculated-about formatcommand/PrintCommand in the FAQ to enable previewing and printing didn't work. The preview-free command set is the one that I got to work at all. (Although my postscript filter is different so I don't use lpr -v.) I have incorporated Nick Williams's changes to tmac.atk and the table of contents prints perfectly. It really is too bad that the page numbers don't! I am running ATK 5.0.0 from the R5 X tape on a Sun Sparc running SunOS 4.1.1. (I know, I should get the updates to Sun OS and ATK, but I haven't taken the time to bring home the CD's and do the grunt work. These revs of the software SHOULD work.) Help? -wdc \enddata{text822, 80368} \begindata{text822, 82576} Return-path: X-Andrew-Authenticated-as: 5904;andrew.cmu.edu;Robert Andrew Ryan Received: from hogtown.andrew.cmu.edu via trymail for info-andrew+@andrew.cmu.edu (->+dist+/afs/andrew.cmu.edu/usr0/ak99/dists/info-andrew-nostrip.dl) ID ; Thu, 12 Nov 1992 03:42:24 -0500 (EST) Received: from hogtown.andrew.cmu.edu via qmail ID ; Thu, 12 Nov 1992 03:40:36 -0500 (EST) Received: from Messages.8.5.N.CUILIB.3.45.SNAP.NOT.LINKED.hogtown.andrew.cmu.edu.sun4c.411 via MS.5.6.hogtown.andrew.cmu.edu.sun4_41; Thu, 12 Nov 1992 03:40:35 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: Date: Thu, 12 Nov 1992 03:40:35 -0500 (EST) From: Robert Andrew Ryan X-Andrew-Message-Size: 550+0 Content-Type: X-BE2; 12 If-Type-Unsupported: send To: Info-Andrew Subject: Re: Who else has ez printing with groff. In-Reply-To: References: \begindata{text,1754256} \textdsversion{12} \template{messages} \excerptedcaption{Excerpts from internet.other.info-andrew: 12-Nov-92 Who else has ez printing wi.. Bill Cattey@athena.mit.e (924)} \quotation{All the pages are shifted up an inch so no page numbers are visible. } This sounds reminiscent of the US vs A4 paper size problem. I believe the groff distribution is delivered with A4 paper configured in the makefile. Sigh... I don't have groff running at the moment, so I'm not sure about the format, preview, and print commands. I am reasonably sure that I did have previewing working with ghostview at one point though... -Rob \enddata{text,1754256} \enddata{text822, 82576} \begindata{text822, 84477} Return-path: X-Andrew-Authenticated-as: 0;andrew.cmu.edu;Network-Mail Received: from po2.andrew.cmu.edu via trymail for info-andrew+@andrew.cmu.edu (->+dist+/afs/andrew.cmu.edu/usr0/ak99/dists/info-andrew-nostrip.dl) ID ; Thu, 12 Nov 1992 04:12:33 -0500 (EST) Received: from po2.andrew.cmu.edu via qmail ID ; Thu, 12 Nov 1992 04:12:08 -0500 (EST) If-Type-Unsupported: send Received: from po3.andrew.cmu.edu via qmail ID ; Thu, 12 Nov 1992 04:10:23 -0500 (EST) Received: from animal.cs.chalmers.se by po3.andrew.cmu.edu (5.54/3.15) id for info-andrew; Thu, 12 Nov 92 04:10:13 EST Received: from muppet82.cs.chalmers.se by animal.cs.chalmers.se (5.60+IDA/3.14+gl) id AA09527; Thu, 12 Nov 92 10:10:09 +0100 Received: by muppet82.cs.chalmers.se (5.60+IDA/3.14+gl) id AA00709; Thu, 12 Nov 92 10:10:08 +0100 Received: from Messages.8.5.N.CUILIB.3.45.SNAP.NOT.LINKED.muppet82.cs.chalmers.se.sun4.41 via MS.5.6.muppet82.cs.chalmers.se.sun4_41; Thu, 12 Nov 1992 10:10:07 +0100 (MET) Message-Id: Date: Thu, 12 Nov 1992 10:10:07 +0100 (MET) From: Christer Bernerus X-Andrew-Message-Size: 967+0 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/richtext; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable To: info-andrew@andrew.cmu.edu Subject: ezmail In order to promote the usage of messages at Chalmers, I'd need an AMS based U= A that runs on a dumb terminal. People don't have workstations at home, but th= ey want to read their mail from home too, and without an agent like this, they= refuse to use messages. In the ATK distribution, the cui and vui UA's are available. None of them have= a user interface that I'd like to present to my users. Now, I've heard that there is a program called EzMail around that might do wha= t I want, but I'd like to know more about availability and functionality. Of s= pecial interest is the capability of handling MIME with at least Content-Tran= sfer encoding and the ISO-8859-1 charset.. Can anyone give me some more info ? Chris. -------------------------------------------------------------------- Christer Bern=E9rus, SM6FBQ !E-mail: bernerus@cs.chalmers.se Chalmers University of Technology ! Phone: +46 31 7721036 Department of Computer Science S-412 96 Gothenburg, SWEDEN \enddata{text822, 84477} \begindata{text822, 87253} Return-path: X-Andrew-Authenticated-as: 0;andrew.cmu.edu;Network-Mail Received: from andrew.cmu.edu via trymail for info-andrew+@andrew.cmu.edu (->+dist+/afs/andrew.cmu.edu/usr0/ak99/dists/info-andrew-nostrip.dl) ID ; Thu, 12 Nov 1992 09:35:12 -0500 (EST) Received: from po3.andrew.cmu.edu via qmail ID ; Thu, 12 Nov 1992 09:33:45 -0500 (EST) Received: from vnet.ibm.com by po3.andrew.cmu.edu (5.54/3.15) id for info-andrew; Thu, 12 Nov 92 09:33:31 EST Received: from RCHLAND by vnet.ibm.com (IBM VM SMTP V2R2) with BSMTP id 1363; Thu, 12 Nov 92 09:30:52 EST Reply-To: "Todd Inglett" Received: by po1.rchland.ibm.com (5.51/4.7) id for info-andrew@andrew.cmu.edu; Thu, 12 Nov 92 08:31:22 CST Received: via switchmail; Thu, 12 Nov 1992 08:31:20 -0600 (CST) Received: from q.rchland.ibm.com via qmail ID ; Thu, 12 Nov 1992 08:28:42 -0600 (CST) Received: from q.rchland.ibm.com via qmail ID ; Thu, 12 Nov 1992 08:28:41 -0600 (CST) Received: from Messages.8.5.N.CUILIB.3.45.SNAP.NOT.LINKED.q.rchland.ibm.com.rs.aix32 via MS.5.6.q.rchland.ibm.com.rs_aix32; Thu, 12 Nov 1992 08:28:40 -0600 (CST) Message-Id: Date: Thu, 12 Nov 1992 08:28:40 -0600 (CST) From: Todd Inglett X-Andrew-Message-Size: 1428+0 Content-Type: X-BE2; 12 If-Type-Unsupported: send To: info-andrew@andrew.cmu.edu Subject: Re: Making a hyperlink running another program ? In-Reply-To: <1992Nov11.094617.15591@atomica.fi> References: <1992Nov11.094617.15591@atomica.fi> \begindata{text,538939656} \textdsversion{12} \template{messages} \excerptedcaption{Excerpts from ext.misc.info-andrew: 11-Nov-92 Making a hyperlink running .. Dag Nygren@bloom-beacon. (533)} \quotation{is there a way of using pushbuttons to run other programs from a ez document? } I just finished a small project which does just this, however it is a bit more difficult than to simply create a button that runs a command. Obviously the command could do something malicious. Just look at the hoops that ness goes through to protect users! My idea is to create a button (I call it \italic{runbutton} for lack of a better name) that could run an arbitrary command, but the ordinary PATH is \italic{not} used to execute the command. Instead a preference is used to search a limited set of directories. Presumably administrators would police the commands in those directories. Also, the command name cannot contain slashes (no absolute or ../../xxx relative commands). It also does not use a shell to execute the command so shell metacharacters like backquote are not interpreted. I also plan to look for command's whose names are the form xxx.n, which I will assume is a ness script. In this case, I will compile and execute the ness code automatically when the button is pushed. This allows the ness to take control of the window, asking questions, etc. Anybody see any security holes in this plan? I haven't looked at the Ness idea too closely yet, but it looks trivial. I don't know about security there, though. -todd inglett \enddata{text,538939656} \enddata{text822, 87253} \begindata{text822, 90818} Return-path: X-Andrew-Authenticated-as: 0;andrew.cmu.edu;Network-Mail Received: from po4.andrew.cmu.edu via trymail for info-andrew+@andrew.cmu.edu (->+dist+/afs/andrew.cmu.edu/usr0/ak99/dists/info-andrew-nostrip.dl) ID ; Thu, 12 Nov 1992 11:20:41 -0500 (EST) Received: from po5.andrew.cmu.edu via qmail ID ; Thu, 12 Nov 1992 11:17:00 -0500 (EST) Received: from Athena.MIT.EDU (ATHENA-AS-WELL.MIT.EDU) by po5.andrew.cmu.edu (5.54/3.15) id for rr2b+; Thu, 12 Nov 92 11:16:43 EST Received: from OGLALA.MIT.EDU by Athena.MIT.EDU with SMTP id AA17316; Thu, 12 Nov 92 11:16:38 EST Received: by oglala (5.57/4.7) id AA01212; Thu, 12 Nov 92 11:16:35 -0500 Received: from VUI.Andrew.3.70.CUILIB.3.45.SNAP.NOT.LINKED.oglala.pmax.ul4 via MS.5.6.oglala.pmax_ul4; Thu, 12 Nov 1992 11:16:34 -0500 (EST) Message-Id: <8f0cBWUGf04744gmtx@athena.mit.edu> Date: Thu, 12 Nov 1992 11:16:34 -0500 (EST) From: Bill Cattey To: Info-Andrew , Robert Andrew Ryan Subject: Re: Who else has ez printing with groff. Cc: In-Reply-To: References: Thanks! It did indeed define PAGE to A4. I'm recompiling now. I expect it will work. I figured it was something simple that someone already knew... -wdc \enddata{text822, 90818} \begindata{text822, 92470} Return-path: X-Andrew-Authenticated-as: 0;andrew.cmu.edu;Network-Mail Received: from po4.andrew.cmu.edu via trymail for info-andrew+@andrew.cmu.edu (->+dist+/afs/andrew.cmu.edu/usr0/ak99/dists/info-andrew-nostrip.dl) ID ; Thu, 12 Nov 1992 12:23:41 -0500 (EST) Received: from po4.andrew.cmu.edu via qmail ID ; Thu, 12 Nov 1992 12:21:52 -0500 (EST) If-Type-Unsupported: send Received: from po3.andrew.cmu.edu via qmail ID ; Thu, 12 Nov 1992 12:19:25 -0500 (EST) Received: from zeta.saintjoe.edu by po3.andrew.cmu.edu (5.54/3.15) id for info-andrew; Thu, 12 Nov 92 12:19:07 EST Received: from fearless.CompSci (fearless.saintjoe.edu) by zeta.saintjoe.edu (4.0/SMI-4.0) id AA08078; Thu, 12 Nov 92 11:17:54 CST Received: by fearless.CompSci (4.1/SMI-4.1) id AA00624; Thu, 12 Nov 92 11:17:53 PST Received: from Messages.8.5.N.CUILIB.3.45.SNAP.NOT.LINKED.fearless.CompSci.sun4.41 via MS.5.6.fearless.CompSci.sun4_41; Thu, 12 Nov 1992 11:17:51 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <8f0erTW3LE06E28Lh9@fearless.CompSci> Date: Thu, 12 Nov 1992 11:17:51 -0800 (PST) From: Brian Capouch Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII To: info-andrew@andrew.cmu.edu Subject: Exposing Message Folders I'm one of those who likes to have all my message folders showing all the time. I've just recently installed the CDROM version of Andrew on all our workstations, and the new version, after one chooses the "Read Mail" menu option, hides all the folders except the main one. I've read and re-read the help files, and can't hit the magic combination. Any help would be appreciated. Brian Capouch brianc@saintjoe.edu \enddata{text822, 92470} \begindata{text822, 94475} Return-path: X-Andrew-Authenticated-as: 1447;andrew.cmu.edu;Gary Keim Received: from rascal.andrew.cmu.edu via trymail for info-andrew+@andrew.cmu.edu (->+dist+/afs/andrew.cmu.edu/usr0/ak99/dists/info-andrew-nostrip.dl) ID ; Thu, 12 Nov 1992 13:19:46 -0500 (EST) Received: from rascal.andrew.cmu.edu via qmail ID ; Thu, 12 Nov 1992 13:18:53 -0500 (EST) Received: from Messages.8.5.N.CUILIB.3.45.SNAP.NOT.LINKED.rascal.andrew.cmu.edu.rs.aix31 via MS.5.6.rascal.andrew.cmu.edu.rs_aix31; Thu, 12 Nov 1992 13:18:52 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: Date: Thu, 12 Nov 1992 13:18:52 -0500 (EST) From: Gary Keim To: Info-Andrew Subject: Re: Exposing Message Folders In-Reply-To: <8f0erTW3LE06E28Lh9@fearless.CompSci> References: <8f0erTW3LE06E28Lh9@fearless.CompSci> Excerpts from misc: 12-Nov-92 Exposing Message Folders Brian Capouch@fearless.C (421*) I've read and re-read the help files, and can't hit the magic combination. And I'm sorry to say that you won't hit the combination if you're using the binaries off the CDROM. We've since made it a preference, but that doesn't help you: sorry. Gary \enddata{text822, 94475} \begindata{text822, 95928} Return-path: X-Andrew-Authenticated-as: 0;andrew.cmu.edu;Network-Mail Received: from po2.andrew.cmu.edu via trymail for info-andrew+@andrew.cmu.edu (->+dist+/afs/andrew.cmu.edu/usr0/ak99/dists/info-andrew-nostrip.dl) ID ; Thu, 12 Nov 1992 18:22:14 -0500 (EST) Received: from po5.andrew.cmu.edu via qmail ID ; Thu, 12 Nov 1992 18:19:46 -0500 (EST) Received: from ucbvax.Berkeley.EDU by po5.andrew.cmu.edu (5.54/3.15) id for info-andrew; Thu, 12 Nov 92 18:19:05 EST Received: by ucbvax.Berkeley.EDU (5.63/1.43) id AA01026; Thu, 12 Nov 92 15:15:59 -0800 Received: from USENET by ucbvax.Berkeley.EDU with netnews for info-andrew@andrew.cmu.edu (info-andrew@andrew.cmu.edu) (contact usenet@ucbvax.Berkeley.EDU if you have questions) Date: 11 Nov 92 14:57:54 GMT From: rr2b+@andrew.cmu.edu (Robert Andrew Ryan) Organization: School of Computer Science, Carnegie Mellon, Pittsburgh, PA Subject: Re: PSDIT Message-Id: References: <1992Nov10.222345.12659@fsl.noaa.gov> Sender: info-andrew-request@andrew.cmu.edu To: info-andrew@andrew.cmu.edu Excerpts from netnews.comp.soft-sys.andrew: 10-Nov-92 PSDIT Leslie Hart@nipmuc.fsl.n (107) > I don't have psdit on my system. Is there a (PD) place I can find psdit? Unfortunately not, see below for Adobe's address. If you have C/A/T troff you can use psroff. Alternately you can get the GNU groff (which requires C++, AT&T cfront 2.1, and gcc 2.2.2 have been used successfully). No endorsement of the following products or organizations is implied. We routinely use transcript, and we have successfully used groff compiled both with gcc 2.2.2 and with AT&T cfront 2.1. From the ATK FAQ: transcript (psdit) Contact: Adobe 1585 Charleston Road P.O. Box 7900 Mountain View, CA 94039-7900 phone: 1-800-833-6687 psroff (note that psroff doesn't allow printing of embedded postscript, used for rasters, zips, and in the next release figures.) Software augmenting troff and providing printer drivers. on cdrom: src/util/psroff is version 3.0 patch level 07 contact: Chris Lewis psroff-request@ferret.ocunix.on.ca GNU software: groff, g++, gcc, gdb, gnuemacs, ... Free software, eventually replacing Un*x ftp: prep.ai.mit.edu see pub/gnu/GNUinfo/FTP and pub/gnu/etc/DISTRIB email: gnu@prep.ai.mit.edu mailing address: Free Software Foundation, Inc. 675 Massachusetts Avenue Cambridge, MA 02139 USA phone: +1 617-876-3296 -Rob Ryan Andrew Consortium \enddata{text822, 95928} \begindata{text822, 98708} Return-path: X-Andrew-Authenticated-as: 0;andrew.cmu.edu;Network-Mail Received: from andrew.cmu.edu via trymail for info-andrew+@andrew.cmu.edu (->+dist+/afs/andrew.cmu.edu/usr0/ak99/dists/info-andrew-nostrip.dl) ID ; Fri, 13 Nov 1992 00:22:24 -0500 (EST) Received: from po5.andrew.cmu.edu via qmail ID ; Fri, 13 Nov 1992 00:21:17 -0500 (EST) Received: from ucbvax.Berkeley.EDU by po5.andrew.cmu.edu (5.54/3.15) id for info-andrew; Fri, 13 Nov 92 00:20:53 EST Received: by ucbvax.Berkeley.EDU (5.63/1.43) id AA14554; Thu, 12 Nov 92 21:18:13 -0800 Received: from USENET by ucbvax.Berkeley.EDU with netnews for info-andrew@andrew.cmu.edu (info-andrew@andrew.cmu.edu) (contact usenet@ucbvax.Berkeley.EDU if you have questions) Date: 10 Nov 92 16:21:43 GMT From: netcomsv!firewall!jlc@decwrl.dec.com (Jean-Luc Chatelain) Organization: Adac Laboratories, Milpitas Ca Subject: How to I suppress page number printing in EZ ? Message-Id: <1992Nov10.082143@firewalladaclabs.com> Sender: info-andrew-request@andrew.cmu.edu To: info-andrew@andrew.cmu.edu I guess the subject says it all, I would like to ezprint a document but tell ezprint to forget about putting page numbers ? Thank you Jean-Luc -- Jean-Luc Chatelain VOICE: 408 321 9100 x1797 ADAC Laboratories VMAIL: 800 SAY ADAC x1797 540 Alder Driver INET : jlc@adaclabs.com Milpitas, CA 95035 Disclaimer: Any opinion expressed is my own may and not reflect the views of ADAC Laboratories \enddata{text822, 98708} \begindata{text822, 100423} Return-path: X-Andrew-Authenticated-as: 0;andrew.cmu.edu;Network-Mail Received: from po5.andrew.cmu.edu via trymail for info-andrew+@andrew.cmu.edu (->+dist+/afs/andrew.cmu.edu/usr0/ak99/dists/info-andrew-nostrip.dl) ID ; Fri, 13 Nov 1992 02:36:23 -0500 (EST) Received: from po5.andrew.cmu.edu via qmail ID ; Fri, 13 Nov 1992 02:35:35 -0500 (EST) Received: from ucbvax.Berkeley.EDU by po5.andrew.cmu.edu (5.54/3.15) id for info-andrew; Fri, 13 Nov 92 02:35:24 EST Received: by ucbvax.Berkeley.EDU (5.63/1.43) id AA19556; Thu, 12 Nov 92 23:33:34 -0800 Received: from USENET by ucbvax.Berkeley.EDU with netnews for info-andrew@andrew.cmu.edu (info-andrew@andrew.cmu.edu) (contact usenet@ucbvax.Berkeley.EDU if you have questions) Date: 10 Nov 92 17:42:57 GMT From: netcomsv!firewall!jlc@decwrl.dec.com (Jean-Luc Chatelain) Organization: Adac Laboratories, Milpitas Ca Subject: Re: compchar question Message-Id: <1992Nov10.094257@firewalladaclabs.com> References: Sender: info-andrew-request@andrew.cmu.edu To: info-andrew@andrew.cmu.edu One way is to use the lookz inset to add a new style (add new style menu entry of lookz) into the font menu card. You could call this style 'symbol' and bind it to the symbola font family which contains the (r) and (c) characters as characters values 0x62 and 0x63. It works, I'am using it :-) jlc -- Jean-Luc Chatelain VOICE: 408 321 9100 x1797 ADAC Laboratories VMAIL: 800 SAY ADAC x1797 540 Alder Driver INET : jlc@adaclabs.com Milpitas, CA 95035 Disclaimer: Any opinion expressed is my own may and not reflect the views of ADAC Laboratories \enddata{text822, 100423} \begindata{text822, 102318} Return-path: X-Andrew-Authenticated-as: 0;andrew.cmu.edu;Network-Mail Received: from po2.andrew.cmu.edu via trymail for info-andrew+@andrew.cmu.edu (->+dist+/afs/andrew.cmu.edu/usr0/ak99/dists/info-andrew-nostrip.dl) ID ; Fri, 13 Nov 1992 09:47:09 -0500 (EST) Received: from po3.andrew.cmu.edu via qmail ID ; Fri, 13 Nov 1992 09:45:43 -0500 (EST) Received: from vnet.ibm.com by po3.andrew.cmu.edu (5.54/3.15) id for info-andrew; Fri, 13 Nov 92 09:45:30 EST Received: from RCHLAND by vnet.ibm.com (IBM VM SMTP V2R2) with BSMTP id 5103; Fri, 13 Nov 92 09:43:29 EST Reply-To: "Todd Inglett" Received: by po1.rchland.ibm.com (5.51/4.7) id for info-andrew@andrew.cmu.edu; Fri, 13 Nov 92 08:43:21 CST Received: via switchmail; Fri, 13 Nov 1992 08:43:18 -0600 (CST) Received: from q.rchland.ibm.com via qmail ID ; Fri, 13 Nov 1992 08:40:43 -0600 (CST) Received: from q.rchland.ibm.com via qmail ID ; Fri, 13 Nov 1992 08:40:42 -0600 (CST) Received: from Messages.8.5.N.CUILIB.3.45.SNAP.NOT.LINKED.q.rchland.ibm.com.rs.aix32 via MS.5.6.q.rchland.ibm.com.rs_aix32; Fri, 13 Nov 1992 08:40:41 -0600 (CST) Message-Id: <0f0vtdk91Jbd1FaFca@rchland.ibm.com> Date: Fri, 13 Nov 1992 08:40:41 -0600 (CST) From: Todd Inglett X-Andrew-Message-Size: 200+1 Content-Type: X-BE2; 12 If-Type-Unsupported: send To: info-andrew@andrew.cmu.edu Subject: Re: How to I suppress page number printing in EZ ? In-Reply-To: <1992Nov10.082143@firewalladaclabs.com> References: <1992Nov10.082143@firewalladaclabs.com> \begindata{text,539260488} \textdsversion{12} \template{messages} My favorite way to suppress line numbering is to change the middle string in the page header using the \italic{header} inset. Here is an example: \begindata{header,539406184} where:header active:111 \begindata{text,539406264} \textdsversion{12} \enddata{text,539406264} \begindata{text,539406616} \textdsversion{12} \ \enddata{text,539406616} \begindata{text,539406968} \textdsversion{12} \enddata{text,539406968} \enddata{header,539406184} \view{headrtv,539406184,1,0,0} Use a blank character for the middle string. -todd inglett \enddata{text,539260488} \enddata{text822, 102318} \begindata{text822, 104952} Return-path: X-Andrew-Authenticated-as: 0;andrew.cmu.edu;Network-Mail Received: from andrew.cmu.edu via trymail for info-andrew+@andrew.cmu.edu (->+dist+/afs/andrew.cmu.edu/usr0/ak99/dists/info-andrew-nostrip.dl) ID ; Fri, 13 Nov 1992 12:51:43 -0500 (EST) Received: from po5.andrew.cmu.edu via qmail ID ; Fri, 13 Nov 1992 12:50:17 -0500 (EST) Received: from ucbvax.Berkeley.EDU by po5.andrew.cmu.edu (5.54/3.15) id for info-andrew; Fri, 13 Nov 92 12:50:08 EST Received: by ucbvax.Berkeley.EDU (5.63/1.43) id AA29467; Fri, 13 Nov 92 09:38:16 -0800 Received: from USENET by ucbvax.Berkeley.EDU with netnews for info-andrew@andrew.cmu.edu (info-andrew@andrew.cmu.edu) (contact usenet@ucbvax.Berkeley.EDU if you have questions) Date: 12 Nov 92 16:02:30 GMT From: rohvm1!rbntjc@cunyvm.cuny.edu (Thomas J Cozzolino) Organization: Rohm and Haas Company Subject: Andrew under AIX (3.2)? Message-Id: <92317.110230RBNTJC@rohvm1.rohmhaas.com> Sender: info-andrew-request@andrew.cmu.edu To: info-andrew@andrew.cmu.edu The title mostly says it. Is there a ready-to-run version of Andrew publicly available for RS/6000 under 3.2.X? Can I grab it via FTP? Please respond directly if possible; sorry if this is a FAQ. +============================================+ | Thomas J. Cozzolino - Rohm and Haas Co. = | InterNet: tcozz@rohmhaas.com = | = | Internet Access for Everyone.. = | Isn't it time? = | = | - Opinions expressed are my own, not = | necessarily those of Rohm and Haas Company = +=====================================================+ \enddata{text822, 104952} \begindata{text822, 106943} Return-path: X-Andrew-Authenticated-as: 0;andrew.cmu.edu;Network-Mail Received: from po2.andrew.cmu.edu via trymail for info-andrew+@andrew.cmu.edu (->+dist+/afs/andrew.cmu.edu/usr0/ak99/dists/info-andrew-nostrip.dl) ID ; Fri, 13 Nov 1992 13:05:50 -0500 (EST) Received: from po3.andrew.cmu.edu via qmail ID ; Fri, 13 Nov 1992 13:03:55 -0500 (EST) Received: from sun2.nsfnet-relay.ac.uk by po3.andrew.cmu.edu (5.54/3.15) id for info-andrew; Fri, 13 Nov 92 13:03:23 EST Via: uk.ac.oxford.biochemistry; Fri, 13 Nov 1992 15:27:31 +0000 Received: from bioch.ox.ac.uk (nmrpcd.bioch) by biochemistry.oxford.ac.uk id AA29291; Fri, 13 Nov 92 15:08:15 GMT Received: by bioch.ox.ac.uk (920330.SGI/bioch3.0) id AA04489; Fri, 13 Nov 92 15:08:07 GMT Date: Fri, 13 Nov 92 15:08:07 GMT From: mikes@biochemistry.oxford.ac.uk Message-Id: <9211131508.AA04489@nmrpcd.bioch.bioch.ox.ac.uk> To: info-andrew@andrew.cmu.edu Subject: Assistance request I am building Andrew on my SGI 4D/35 running 4.0.5. I have made significant progress since I last mailed you, and I can now run (some of) Andrew. Alas, not all, as I get the following error from my make World ... [LOTS deleted] Processing post number 18 Processing post number 19 Processing post number 20 Processing post number 21 Processing post number 22 Processing post number 23 Expertise level set to wizard Reconstructing /usr/andrew/.MESSAGES/demo; please wait... Reconstructed folder /usr/andrew/.MESSAGES/demo with twenty-three entries sh: amsdemo: cannot create *** Error code 1 Stop. *** Error code 1 Stop. *** Error code 1 Stop. *** Error code 1 Stop. *** Error code 1 Stop. # Any chance of a spot of help to tell me what might be going on here?? Many thanks Mike Smith \enddata{text822, 106943} \begindata{text822, 108956} Return-path: X-Andrew-Authenticated-as: 0;andrew.cmu.edu;Network-Mail Received: from po2.andrew.cmu.edu via trymail for info-andrew+@andrew.cmu.edu (->+dist+/afs/andrew.cmu.edu/usr0/ak99/dists/info-andrew-nostrip.dl) ID ; Sat, 14 Nov 1992 01:38:26 -0500 (EST) Received: from po5.andrew.cmu.edu via qmail ID ; Sat, 14 Nov 1992 01:36:45 -0500 (EST) Received: from ucbvax.Berkeley.EDU by po5.andrew.cmu.edu (5.54/3.15) id for info-andrew; Sat, 14 Nov 92 01:36:25 EST Received: by ucbvax.Berkeley.EDU (5.63/1.43) id AA26560; Fri, 13 Nov 92 22:30:36 -0800 Received: from USENET by ucbvax.Berkeley.EDU with netnews for info-andrew@andrew.cmu.edu (info-andrew@andrew.cmu.edu) (contact usenet@ucbvax.Berkeley.EDU if you have questions) Date: 10 Nov 92 22:23:45 GMT From: csn!qwerty-gw.fsl.noaa.gov!nipmuc.fsl.noaa.gov!hart@handies.ucar.edu (Leslie Hart) Organization: Forecast Systems Lab, NOAA - Boulder CO, USA Subject: PSDIT Message-Id: <1992Nov10.222345.12659@fsl.noaa.gov> Sender: info-andrew-request@andrew.cmu.edu To: info-andrew@andrew.cmu.edu I don't have psdit on my system. Is there a (PD) place I can find psdit? Leslie Hart (hart@fsl.noaa.gov) \enddata{text822, 108956} \begindata{text822, 110378} Return-path: X-Andrew-Authenticated-as: 0;andrew.cmu.edu;Network-Mail Received: from po5.andrew.cmu.edu via trymail for info-andrew+@andrew.cmu.edu (->+dist+/afs/andrew.cmu.edu/usr0/ak99/dists/info-andrew-nostrip.dl) ID ; Sat, 14 Nov 1992 12:30:32 -0500 (EST) Received: from po5.andrew.cmu.edu via qmail ID ; Sat, 14 Nov 1992 12:26:58 -0500 (EST) Received: from ucbvax.Berkeley.EDU by po5.andrew.cmu.edu (5.54/3.15) id for info-andrew; Sat, 14 Nov 92 12:26:44 EST Received: by ucbvax.Berkeley.EDU (5.63/1.43) id AA23454; Sat, 14 Nov 92 09:21:30 -0800 Received: from USENET by ucbvax.Berkeley.EDU with netnews for info-andrew@andrew.cmu.edu (info-andrew@andrew.cmu.edu) (contact usenet@ucbvax.Berkeley.EDU if you have questions) Date: 13 Nov 92 18:46:44 GMT From: cis.ohio-state.edu!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!darwin.sura.net!nih-csl.dcrt.nih.gov!daedalus.dcrt.nih.gov!weisen@ucbvax.Berkeley.EDU (Neil Weisenfeld) Organization: National Insts. of Health, DCRT, CSL Subject: Question about AMDS message delivery Message-Id: <1992Nov13.184644.19701@alw.nih.gov> Sender: info-andrew-request@andrew.cmu.edu To: info-andrew@andrew.cmu.edu Our AMDS system is set up so that a number of machines may deliver the same message. Is there any sort of locking system used to keep them from stepping on each other's toes? I'm writing a biff program and it seems to suffer from two ailments: 1. Sometimes the user gets informed about a message twice since its modification time changes twice. 2. Sometimes the biff program starts scanning the message for headers as the message is being written and subsequently winds up hitting EOF before finding all of the headers. Now I know that I could solve #1 by keying off of the filename and not checking the same file twice, but how about #2? Is there some lock mechanism for the Mailbox directory or the message files, or is it just a free for all? Thanks, Neil -- Neil I. Weisenfeld National Institutes of Health Computer Engineer Building 12A, Room 2033 weisen@alw.nih.gov Bethesda, MD 20892 uunet!nih-csl!weisen phone: (301) 402-2788 \enddata{text822, 110378} \begindata{text822, 112804} Return-path: X-Andrew-Authenticated-as: 0;andrew.cmu.edu;Network-Mail Received: from andrew.cmu.edu via trymail for info-andrew+@andrew.cmu.edu (->+dist+/afs/andrew.cmu.edu/usr0/ak99/dists/info-andrew-nostrip.dl) ID ; Sat, 14 Nov 1992 13:54:40 -0500 (EST) Received: from po5.andrew.cmu.edu via qmail ID ; Sat, 14 Nov 1992 13:52:51 -0500 (EST) Received: from ucbvax.Berkeley.EDU by po5.andrew.cmu.edu (5.54/3.15) id for info-andrew; Sat, 14 Nov 92 13:52:44 EST Received: by ucbvax.Berkeley.EDU (5.63/1.43) id AA26499; Sat, 14 Nov 92 10:41:33 -0800 Received: from USENET by ucbvax.Berkeley.EDU with netnews for info-andrew@andrew.cmu.edu (info-andrew@andrew.cmu.edu) (contact usenet@ucbvax.Berkeley.EDU if you have questions) Date: 11 Nov 92 19:25:40 GMT From: rr2b+@andrew.cmu.edu (Robert Andrew Ryan) Organization: School of Computer Science, Carnegie Mellon, Pittsburgh, PA Subject: Re: Making a hyperlink running another program ? Message-Id: References: <1992Nov11.094617.15591@atomica.fi> Sender: info-andrew-request@andrew.cmu.edu To: info-andrew@andrew.cmu.edu Excerpts from netnews.comp.soft-sys.andrew: 11-Nov-92 Making a hyperlink running .. Dag Nygren@atomica.fi (535) is there a way of using pushbuttons to run other programs from a ez document? The problem with doing this is that the general case is a rather nasty security hole. That is if you can send mail or a bboard post with a button with any arbitrary command there is a much greater risk of a (pick your favorite computer program nasty) deleting all your files, or looking at private data. Under ATTBL_ENV in atk/hyplink/linkv.c there is some code for having buttons which execute a command, but it depends on a class we didn't pick up from the contributors... (AT&T Bell Labs). It might be cool to subclass linkv so that selected programs could be run on the destination of a link, but care would be needed to ensure that security isn't compromised. (For example having a filename like blah`rm -rf $HOME/*`foo go through sh would be unfortunate...) -Rob Ryan Andrew Consortium \enddata{text822, 112804} \begindata{text822, 115168} Return-path: X-Andrew-Authenticated-as: 0;andrew.cmu.edu;Network-Mail Received: from po4.andrew.cmu.edu via trymail for info-andrew+@andrew.cmu.edu (->+dist+/afs/andrew.cmu.edu/usr0/ak99/dists/info-andrew-nostrip.dl) ID ; Sat, 14 Nov 1992 15:00:50 -0500 (EST) Received: from po5.andrew.cmu.edu via qmail ID ; Sat, 14 Nov 1992 14:59:15 -0500 (EST) Received: from Athena.MIT.EDU (ATHENA-AS-WELL.MIT.EDU) by po5.andrew.cmu.edu (5.54/3.15) id for info-andrew; Sat, 14 Nov 92 14:59:06 EST Received: from OGLALA.MIT.EDU by Athena.MIT.EDU with SMTP id AA29867; Sat, 14 Nov 92 14:59:03 EST Received: by oglala (5.57/4.7) id AA13698; Sat, 14 Nov 92 14:59:02 -0500 Received: from VUI.Andrew.3.70.CUILIB.3.45.SNAP.NOT.LINKED.oglala.pmax.ul4 via MS.5.6.oglala.pmax_ul4; Sat, 14 Nov 1992 14:59:01 -0500 (EST) Message-Id: Date: Sat, 14 Nov 1992 14:59:01 -0500 (EST) From: Bill Cattey To: info-andrew@andrew.cmu.edu Subject: Re: compchar question References: > One way is to use the lookz inset to add a new style (add new style > menu entry of lookz) into the font menu card. You could call this > style 'symbol' and bind it to the symbola font family which > contains the (r) and (c) characters as characters values 0x62 and 0x63. > > It works, I'am using it :-) > jlc You only THINK it works. There are a varitey of things that WILL go wrong with doing it like this. There is already a template called symbol which you could use instead of using lookz. It creates a style 'symbol' and binds that to the symbol font and a style 'symbola' and binds that to the symbola font. Your mechanism will perform VERY strangely when you insert a character composition that needs the symbol font. It will get the symbol style which you lookz has mis-mapped to the symbola font and the characters will NOT be what you expect. Also since troff requires a special command sequence to print the copyright and registered trademark symbols, using either lookz, or the symbol template will not print anything out! I suggest you do ^xxrg for the registered trademark symbol and ^xxco for the copyright symbol. These character compositions work, are simple, and print, and they don't break anything else in your document. I appologize for the documentation on these symbols not being clear enough. -wdc Co- developer of compositions (actually Rob Ryan did all the hard work.) \enddata{text822, 115168} \begindata{text822, 117908} Return-path: X-Andrew-Authenticated-as: 0;andrew.cmu.edu;Network-Mail Received: from po2.andrew.cmu.edu via trymail for info-andrew+@andrew.cmu.edu (->+dist+/afs/andrew.cmu.edu/usr0/ak99/dists/info-andrew-nostrip.dl) ID ; Mon, 16 Nov 1992 13:28:12 -0500 (EST) Received: from po5.andrew.cmu.edu via qmail ID ; Mon, 16 Nov 1992 13:24:43 -0500 (EST) Received: from ucbvax.Berkeley.EDU by po5.andrew.cmu.edu (5.54/3.15) id for info-andrew; Mon, 16 Nov 92 13:24:17 EST Received: by ucbvax.Berkeley.EDU (5.63/1.43) id AA28218; Mon, 16 Nov 92 10:01:28 -0800 Received: from USENET by ucbvax.Berkeley.EDU with netnews for info-andrew@andrew.cmu.edu (info-andrew@andrew.cmu.edu) (contact usenet@ucbvax.Berkeley.EDU if you have questions) Date: 16 Nov 92 04:13:34 GMT From: mentor.cc.purdue.edu!noose.ecn.purdue.edu!samsung!transfer.stratus.com!applix!jim@purdue.edu (Jim Morton [ext 237]) Organization: Applix, Inc., Westboro, MA Subject: Re: Postscript Printing Comments? (was) Re: Printers Message-Id: <1665@applix.com> References: , Sender: info-andrew-request@andrew.cmu.edu To: info-andrew@andrew.cmu.edu In article , Bob_Dew@ALW.NIH.GOV writes: ] A drawback with WYSIWYG editors as you describe is that they require a ] binary format in which to store working drafts and editable document ] copies. One can rest assured that there will never exist a ] WYSIWYG-to-ATK interpreter. ] ] I think one of the celebrated features that ATK offers over many (if not ] all) commercially available counterparts is that its intermediate data ] format is non-proprietary and ASCII readable. This open systems ] approach, to coin increasingly popular buzz term, makes text formatting ] packages like ATK far more attractive, in my opinion, than similar ] look-alikes (like Rapport and Asterix, for examples) which have limited ] usefulness outside of their own proprietary formatting protocols. Whoa - hold on a second! Aster*x documents are NOT binary, and have identical formats on the 14 platforms that it runs on. Furthermore, we will gladly provide format specifications for the three document formats (Words, Graphics, and Spreadsheets) to anyone who asks. And even further, we provide easy macro and socket hooks, with examples, for anyone who wants to hook up to outside applications. Aster*x had open-ness and extensibility as design requirements from day 1... -- Jim Morton, Applix Inc., Westboro, MA ...uunet!applix!jim jim@applix.com \enddata{text822, 117908} \begindata{text822, 120716} X-Andrew-Authenticated-As: 469;andrew.cmu.edu;Craig F. Everhart Return-path: X-Andrew-Authenticated-as: 1312;transarc.com;Craig Everhart Received: from mobius via trymail for info-andrew+@andrew.cmu.edu (->+dist+/afs/andrew.cmu.edu/usr0/ak99/dists/info-andrew-nostrip.dl) (->+dist+/afs/andrew.cmu.edu/usr0/ak99/dists/info-andrew-nostrip.dl@andrew.cmu.edu) ID ; Mon, 16 Nov 1992 15:16:50 -0500 (EST) If-Type-Unsupported: send Received: from mobius via qmail ID ; Mon, 16 Nov 1992 15:10:42 -0500 (EST) Received: from Messages.7.14.N.CUILIB.3.45.SNAP.NOT.LINKED.mobius.sun4.40 via MS.5.6.mobius.sun4_40; Mon, 16 Nov 1992 15:10:33 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: Date: Mon, 16 Nov 1992 15:10:33 -0500 (EST) From: Craig_Everhart@transarc.com X-Andrew-Message-Size: 2694+0 Content-Type: X-BE2; 12 To: Info-Andrew , Neil_Weisenfeld@alw.nih.gov (Neil Weisenfeld) Subject: Re: Question about AMDS message delivery In-Reply-To: <1992Nov13.184644.19701@alw.nih.gov> References: <1992Nov13.184644.19701@alw.nih.gov> \begindata{text,3500880} \textdsversion{12} \template{messages} \excerptedcaption{Excerpts from internet.other.info-andrew: 13-Nov-92 Question about AMDS message.. Neil Weisenfeld@ucbvax.B (1023)} \quotation{Our AMDS system is set up so that a number of machines may deliver the }\quotation{same message. Is there any sort of locking system used to keep them }\quotation{from stepping on each other's toes? I'm writing a biff program and it }\quotation{seems to suffer from two ailments: } \quotation{1. Sometimes the user gets informed about a message twice since its }\quotation{modification time changes twice. } \quotation{2. Sometimes the biff program starts scanning the message for headers }\quotation{as the message is being written and subsequently winds up hitting EOF }\quotation{before finding all of the headers. } \quotation{Now I know that I could solve #1 by keying off of the filename and not }\quotation{checking the same file twice, but how about #2? Is there some lock }\quotation{mechanism for the Mailbox directory or the message files, or is it just }\quotation{a free for all? } Sure, there's a locking mechanism. You can solve both problems by using it. The delivery protocol for new messages being created in ~userid/Mailbox/ is as follows. The delivery agent (the producer) follows one protocol, and the reader (the consumer) follows another. Delivery agent/producer: \leftindent{(d1) invent a filename (generally with an ams_genid() call); call it FOO (d2) create ~userid/Mailbox/FOO with open(), getting a file descriptor (``fd'') (d3) flock(fd) with an exclusive lock. \leftindent{-- on failure, close the file, leaving a zero-length file; restart at step (d1), creating a new file name. }(d4) write the contents of the file (d5) close the file, releasing the lock in the process. } Reader/consumer: For each file in the ~/Mailbox directory (here named FOO): \leftindent{(r1) open the ~/Mailbox/FOO file with open(), getting a file descriptor (``fd'') (r2) flock(fd) with an exclusive lock. \leftindent{-- on failure, close the file and skip processing FOO. }(r3) get file status with fstat(fd) or whatever, to check the file length and age. \leftindent{-- if zero-length and under 20 minutes old, close the file and skip processing FOO. -- else if zero-length, ignore it as an orphan. }(r4) read the file and unlink it from ~/Mailbox when done. } At at least one point I believed that this would be an adequate interlock model. The down-side is that if (r1+r2) interleaves between (d2) and (d3), the delivery process leaves an orphaned zero-length file that has to be reaped somehow; hence the heuristic measure as the last clause of (r3). An amds-biff process would be excellent, and could simply follow the same protocol as does the reader, except for unlinking the file in step (r4). I'd argue that both your problems arise when your biff checks new files between (d2) and (d4), and that you can dodge the problem with the flock() protocol. Craig \enddata{text,3500880} \enddata{text822, 120716} \begindata{text822, 125130} Return-path: X-Andrew-Authenticated-as: 0;andrew.cmu.edu;Network-Mail Received: from andrew.cmu.edu via trymail for info-andrew+@andrew.cmu.edu (->+dist+/afs/andrew.cmu.edu/usr0/ak99/dists/info-andrew-nostrip.dl) ID ; Tue, 17 Nov 1992 01:11:31 -0500 (EST) Received: from po5.andrew.cmu.edu via qmail ID ; Tue, 17 Nov 1992 01:09:28 -0500 (EST) Received: from madvax.maths.uwa.oz.au by po5.andrew.cmu.edu (5.54/3.15) id for info-andrew; Tue, 17 Nov 92 01:09:11 EST Received: from nymphaea by madvax.maths.uwa.oz.au with SMTP (5.61+IDA+MU) id AA20771; Tue, 17 Nov 1992 14:09:05 +0800 From: cynthia@maths.uwa.oz.au (Cynthia Belonogoff) Date: Tue, 17 Nov 92 14:07:38 WST Message-Id: <9211170607.AA05741@nymphaea.maths.uwa.oz.au> To: info-andrew@andrew.cmu.edu Subject: ezprint We have just installed the Anrew toolkit at out site and are very impressed by the ez editor and help system. However, printing appears to require ditroff to work properly. Is the source or binary for a Sun sparc station available anywhere? Cynthia Belonogoff Systems Programmer \enddata{text822, 125130} \begindata{text822, 126453} Return-path: X-Andrew-Authenticated-as: 0;andrew.cmu.edu;Network-Mail Received: from po2.andrew.cmu.edu via trymail for info-andrew+@andrew.cmu.edu (->+dist+/afs/andrew.cmu.edu/usr0/ak99/dists/info-andrew-nostrip.dl) ID ; Tue, 17 Nov 1992 01:27:35 -0500 (EST) Received: from po5.andrew.cmu.edu via qmail ID ; Tue, 17 Nov 1992 01:26:09 -0500 (EST) Received: from ucbvax.Berkeley.EDU by po5.andrew.cmu.edu (5.54/3.15) id for info-andrew; Tue, 17 Nov 92 01:25:58 EST Received: by ucbvax.Berkeley.EDU (5.63/1.43) id AA28228; Mon, 16 Nov 92 22:13:02 -0800 Received: from USENET by ucbvax.Berkeley.EDU with netnews for info-andrew@andrew.cmu.edu (info-andrew@andrew.cmu.edu) (contact usenet@ucbvax.Berkeley.EDU if you have questions) Date: 17 Nov 92 05:45:00 GMT From: cis.ohio-state.edu!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!uwm.edu!spool.mu.edu!umn.edu!lynx!draco.unm.edu!opus@ucbvax.Berkeley.EDU (Colby Kraybill) Organization: University of New Mexico, Albuquerque Subject: Printing, using groff, DEC MIPS... Message-Id: <88jq6zr@lynx.unm.edu> Sender: info-andrew-request@andrew.cmu.edu To: info-andrew@andrew.cmu.edu Hello I've run into just hours of fun while trying to print out something with EZ. Here is the exact configuration of the stuff that I am using, EZ Version 7.0, ATK 5.1 on a DEC MIPS 5000/120 running under X11 R5. I am using groff version 1.05. I've put in my global.prf: *.formatcommand: groff -pte -E /tmp/%s.n | *.PrintCommand: lpr -Pljea1 -Dpostscript The printer is an HP IIIsi. Now then, if I try to print, all I get is a cover page. If I sit there and do lpq's I see the job shoot through the printer via stdin with a size of about 6K. I've gone outside of EZ and done a groff manually on the .n file and *Finally* got the thing to print out, however it would be convient to print right from EZ. Any suggestions? -- Colby Kraybill Space and Planetary Image Facility University of New Mexico opus@pioneer.unm.edu \enddata{text822, 126453} \begindata{text822, 128662} Return-path: X-Andrew-Authenticated-as: 0;andrew.cmu.edu;Network-Mail Received: from po2.andrew.cmu.edu via trymail for info-andrew+@andrew.cmu.edu (->+dist+/afs/andrew.cmu.edu/usr0/ak99/dists/info-andrew-nostrip.dl) ID ; Tue, 17 Nov 1992 02:45:47 -0500 (EST) Received: from po5.andrew.cmu.edu via qmail ID ; Tue, 17 Nov 1992 02:44:39 -0500 (EST) Received: from nkosi.well.sf.ca.us by po5.andrew.cmu.edu (5.54/3.15) id for info-andrew; Tue, 17 Nov 92 02:44:31 EST Received: from well.sf.ca.us by nkosi.well.sf.ca.us (5.65c/SMI-4.1/nkosi-921112-1) id AA12970; Mon, 16 Nov 1992 23:45:59 -0800 Received: by well.sf.ca.us (5.65c/SMI-4.1/well-921112-2) id AA10213; Mon, 16 Nov 1992 23:43:39 -0800 Received: from zindigo by z-code.com (4.1/NBN-16/ZC-7) id AA11557; Mon, 16 Nov 92 23:29:08 PST Received: by zindigo (920330.SGI/920502.SGI) for @z-code.z-code.com:andrew.cmu.edu!info-andrew id AA27609; Mon, 16 Nov 92 23:31:10 -0800 From: bobg@zindigo.z-code.com (Bob Glickstein) Message-Id: <9211162331.ZM27607@zindigo.z-code.com> Date: Mon, 16 Nov 1992 23:31:09 -0800 Organization: Z-Code Software Corp., Marin County, CA Reply-To: Bob Glickstein X-Face: =($SY|/2Odk(K$UOYYH88u8x@sP9c'l[^RZwSi<=~B9w.bD}Xueurgex5p1D:0')q.qr8iC%%|X5/3)Fyw-_/+i2V29(;~Rgf.@|7qE,<,cz_3V)c1OZ\yZj'f:QRM=9EqQ?\v&apsKCVfLuQ$46j!B,WJ"~/,A-+KjI;0j7ymyLC5j3gBm} X-Mailer: Z-Mail (2.1.0 10/27/92) To: info-andrew@andrew.cmu.edu Subject: Flakiness on SGI Indigo I've just built most of the Andrew sources as they appear on the CD-ROM release. The build proceeded without a hitch, but I can't say the same for actually running Ez. When reading text with a large inset visible, scrolling backwards via a right-click in the scrollbar sometimes causes a core dump. My platform is an SGI Indigo running Irix 4.0.5F. Before I go hunting for the cause of this bug, can anyone tell me whether I'd be duplicating someone else's efforts? And incidentally, how much has the source changed since the CD-ROM release (I hesitate to ask)? Finally, I too would like to know what my printing alternatives are these days in the absence of ditroff. Has anyone tried using groff with Andrew? -- Bob Glickstein Z-Code Software Corp. 4340 Redwood Highway Suite B-50 San Rafael, CA 94903 (415) 499-8649 \enddata{text822, 128662} \begindata{text822, 131215} Return-path: X-Andrew-Authenticated-as: 0;andrew.cmu.edu;Network-Mail Received: from po4.andrew.cmu.edu via trymail for info-andrew+@andrew.cmu.edu (->+dist+/afs/andrew.cmu.edu/usr0/ak99/dists/info-andrew-nostrip.dl) ID ; Tue, 17 Nov 1992 19:10:49 -0500 (EST) Received: from po3.andrew.cmu.edu via qmail ID ; Tue, 17 Nov 1992 19:04:07 -0500 (EST) Received: from ucbvax.Berkeley.EDU by po3.andrew.cmu.edu (5.54/3.15) id for info-andrew; Tue, 17 Nov 92 19:03:24 EST Received: by ucbvax.Berkeley.EDU (5.63/1.43) id AA24026; Tue, 17 Nov 92 15:06:06 -0800 Received: from USENET by ucbvax.Berkeley.EDU with netnews for info-andrew@andrew.cmu.edu (info-andrew@andrew.cmu.edu) (contact usenet@ucbvax.Berkeley.EDU if you have questions) Date: 17 Nov 92 09:45:54 GMT From: cis.ohio-state.edu!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!uwm.edu!spool.mu.edu!yale.edu!ira.uka.de!ira.uka.de!gmd.de!mayer@ucbvax.Berkeley.EDU (Hans Mayer) Organization: GMD, Sankt Augustin, Germany Subject: Building Andrew on SunOS 4.1.3 Message-Id: Sender: info-andrew-request@andrew.cmu.edu To: info-andrew@andrew.cmu.edu I'm trying to install Andrew on SunOS 4.1.3 and X11R5 patchlevel 19. The build fails in .../andrew/atk/basics/common with: /opt/andrew/bin/makedo -d /opt/andrew/lib -b /opt/andrew/bin -s -o region.do region.o /opt/X11R5/lib/libX11.a Is there a patch available? If yes, where? Why does Andrew generate Makefiles that suddenly try to use static libraries? I'm shure I'm not the first one with this problem but I couldn't find any discussion on it or a FAQ (I've tried to go back a few hundred articles but all but the last forty are already expired). Any help appreciated! Thanks - Hans -- Hans J. Mayer, mayer@gmd.de German National Research Center for Computer Science (GMD) \enddata{text822, 131215} \begindata{text822, 133264} Return-path: X-Andrew-Authenticated-as: 0;andrew.cmu.edu;Network-Mail Received: from po4.andrew.cmu.edu via trymail for info-andrew+@andrew.cmu.edu (->+dist+/afs/andrew.cmu.edu/usr0/ak99/dists/info-andrew-nostrip.dl) ID ; Tue, 17 Nov 1992 19:15:56 -0500 (EST) Received: from po5.andrew.cmu.edu via qmail ID ; Tue, 17 Nov 1992 19:14:24 -0500 (EST) Received: from ucbvax.Berkeley.EDU by po5.andrew.cmu.edu (5.54/3.15) id for info-andrew; Tue, 17 Nov 92 19:14:08 EST Received: by ucbvax.Berkeley.EDU (5.63/1.43) id AA26248; Tue, 17 Nov 92 16:03:58 -0800 Received: from USENET by ucbvax.Berkeley.EDU with netnews for info-andrew@andrew.cmu.edu (info-andrew@andrew.cmu.edu) (contact usenet@ucbvax.Berkeley.EDU if you have questions) Date: 17 Nov 92 23:47:57 GMT From: adobe!usenet@decwrl.dec.com (Zalman Stern) Organization: Adobe Systems Incorporated Subject: Re: message queue with ATK Message-Id: <1992Nov17.234757.5695@adobe.com> Sender: info-andrew-request@andrew.cmu.edu To: info-andrew@andrew.cmu.edu In article <1992Nov17.163509.662@csi.uottawa.ca> isabelle@shamin.genie.uottawa.ca (Isabelle Tourneux) writes: > > I would like to use message queues with ATK and ADEW. > > - is it possible to use the usual msgrcv and msgsnd in an > infinite loop ? I have tried to put an infinite loop in the > "controller_go" of an Adew view-controller, but it disturbs the > usual functionnning of the controller. > > - does an object-oriented function (a sort of "im_AddMessageQueue") > exist to set an input handler when something arrives on a > message queue, just as it does for sockets in im_AddFileHandler ? > > In short, is there a way I can use message queues, or can I use > only sockets to communicate with other processes ? > The namespace for System V message queues is disjoint from the file descriptor namespace. They do not work with select and hence do not fit into ATK interaction model. In short the SysV message and shared memory interfaces are evil crud which never should have been implemented in a UNIX kernel. Use the BSD send and recv calls instead. Or if you have SysVr4, you might try putmsg and getmsg on streams but I'm not sure how that stuff interacts with select. (And it undoubtedly depends on the particular version of UNIX you are running.) -- Zalman Stern zalman@adobe.com (415) 962 3824 Adobe Systems, 1585 Charleston Rd., POB 7900, Mountain View, CA 94039-7900 "Yeah. Ask 'em if they'll upgrade my shifters too." Bill Watterson -- Zalman Stern zalman@adobe.com (415) 962 3824 Adobe Systems, 1585 Charleston Rd., POB 7900, Mountain View, CA 94039-7900 "Yeah. Ask 'em if they'll upgrade my shifters too." Bill Watterson \enddata{text822, 133264} \begindata{text822, 136224} Return-path: X-Andrew-Authenticated-as: 0;andrew.cmu.edu;Network-Mail Received: from andrew.cmu.edu via trymail for info-andrew+@andrew.cmu.edu (->+dist+/afs/andrew.cmu.edu/usr0/ak99/dists/info-andrew-nostrip.dl) ID ; Tue, 17 Nov 1992 19:18:29 -0500 (EST) Received: from po5.andrew.cmu.edu via qmail ID ; Tue, 17 Nov 1992 19:14:24 -0500 (EST) Received: from ucbvax.Berkeley.EDU by po5.andrew.cmu.edu (5.54/3.15) id for info-andrew; Tue, 17 Nov 92 19:13:48 EST Received: by ucbvax.Berkeley.EDU (5.63/1.43) id AA26232; Tue, 17 Nov 92 16:03:31 -0800 Received: from USENET by ucbvax.Berkeley.EDU with netnews for info-andrew@andrew.cmu.edu (info-andrew@andrew.cmu.edu) (contact usenet@ucbvax.Berkeley.EDU if you have questions) Date: 17 Nov 92 23:46:22 GMT From: adobe!usenet@decwrl.dec.com (Zalman Stern) Organization: Adobe Systems Incorporated Subject: Re: message queue with ATK Message-Id: <1992Nov17.234622.5623@adobe.com> References: <1992Nov17.163509.662@csi.uottawa.ca> Sender: info-andrew-request@andrew.cmu.edu To: info-andrew@andrew.cmu.edu In article <1992Nov17.163509.662@csi.uottawa.ca> isabelle@shamin.genie.uottawa.ca (Isabelle Tourneux) writes: > > I would like to use message queues with ATK and ADEW. > > - is it possible to use the usual msgrcv and msgsnd in an > infinite loop ? I have tried to put an infinite loop in the > "controller_go" of an Adew view-controller, but it disturbs the > usual functionnning of the controller. > > - does an object-oriented function (a sort of "im_AddMessageQueue") > exist to set an input handler when something arrives on a > message queue, just as it does for sockets in im_AddFileHandler ? > > In short, is there a way I can use message queues, or can I use > only sockets to communicate with other processes ? > > Thanks > > Isabelle Tourneux > Multimedia Lab of the University of Ottawa, > isabelle@shamin.genie.uottawa.ca The namespace for System V message queues is disjoint from the file descriptor namespace. They do not work with select and hence do not fit into ATK interaction model. In short the SysV message and shared memory interfaces are evil crud which never should have been implemented in a UNIX kernel. Use the BSD send and recv calls instead. Or if you have SysVr4, you might try putmsg and getmsg on streams but I'm not sure how that stuff interacts with select. (And it undoubtedly depends on the particular version of UNIX you are running.) -- Zalman Stern zalman@adobe.com (415) 962 3824 Adobe Systems, 1585 Charleston Rd., POB 7900, Mountain View, CA 94039-7900 "Yeah. Ask 'em if they'll upgrade my shifters too." Bill Watterson \enddata{text822, 136224} \begindata{text822, 139140} Return-path: X-Andrew-Authenticated-as: 0;andrew.cmu.edu;Network-Mail Received: from andrew.cmu.edu via trymail for info-andrew+@andrew.cmu.edu (->+dist+/afs/andrew.cmu.edu/usr0/ak99/dists/info-andrew-nostrip.dl) ID ; Tue, 17 Nov 1992 20:02:40 -0500 (EST) Received: from po5.andrew.cmu.edu via qmail ID ; Tue, 17 Nov 1992 19:59:23 -0500 (EST) Received: from ucbvax.Berkeley.EDU by po5.andrew.cmu.edu (5.54/3.15) id for info-andrew; Tue, 17 Nov 92 19:59:02 EST Received: by ucbvax.Berkeley.EDU (5.63/1.43) id AA27955; Tue, 17 Nov 92 16:48:02 -0800 Received: from USENET by ucbvax.Berkeley.EDU with netnews for info-andrew@andrew.cmu.edu (info-andrew@andrew.cmu.edu) (contact usenet@ucbvax.Berkeley.EDU if you have questions) Date: 17 Nov 92 12:17:39 GMT From: cis.ohio-state.edu!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!uwm.edu!spool.mu.edu!sgiblab!munnari.oz.au!titan!castor!keck@ucbvax.Berkeley.EDU (Brian Keck) Organization: Telecom Research Labs,Melbourne, Australia Subject: help with insets Message-Id: <1992Nov17.121739.8941@trl.oz.au> Sender: info-andrew-request@andrew.cmu.edu To: info-andrew@andrew.cmu.edu I'm a beginner at ez, zip, et al, & have got stuck. I'm trying to insert (zip inset) a picture in a text file (ez). It basically works, but I get too much white space. I'm hoping someone can tell me how to avoid it. Detail: "ez fred", where fred is a plain text file. caret moved to a random place esc tab "zip" plug in the November calendar browse the calendar is OK, but there's 2 or 3 times its height of white space below it Scaling is no good because it changes the size of the calendar. The white space seems impervious to ez. I've tried changing zip.geometry. Any general tips/pointers on method welcome. Thanks, Brian Keck b.keck@trl.oz.au, phone +61 3 253 6407, fax +61 3 253 6362 Network Services & Signalling, Telecom Research Laboratories 770 Blackburn Rd, Clayton Victoria 3168, Australia \enddata{text822, 139140} \begindata{text822, 141340} Return-path: X-Andrew-Authenticated-as: 5904;andrew.cmu.edu;Robert Andrew Ryan Received: from po4.andrew.cmu.edu via trymail for info-andrew+@andrew.cmu.edu (->+dist+/afs/andrew.cmu.edu/usr0/ak99/dists/info-andrew-nostrip.dl) ID ; Wed, 18 Nov 1992 00:46:27 -0500 (EST) If-Type-Unsupported: send Received: from GS16.SP.CS.CMU.EDU via qmail ID ; Tue, 17 Nov 1992 10:51:08 -0500 (EST) Received: from Messages.8.5.N.CUILIB.3.45.SNAP.NOT.LINKED.GS16.SP.CS.CMU.EDU.rt.aos4 via MS.5.6.GS16.SP.CS.CMU.EDU.rt_aos4; Tue, 17 Nov 1992 10:51:08 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: Date: Tue, 17 Nov 1992 10:51:08 -0500 (EST) From: Robert Andrew Ryan X-Andrew-Message-Size: 1142+0 Content-Type: X-BE2; 12 To: Info-Andrew , cynthia@maths.uwa.oz.au Subject: ATK printing (was Re: ezprint) In-Reply-To: <9211170607.AA05741@nymphaea.maths.uwa.oz.au> References: <9211170607.AA05741@nymphaea.maths.uwa.oz.au> \begindata{text,270797428} \textdsversion{12} \template{messages} The following packages allow printing with ATK. No endorsement of the following products or organizations is implied. We routinely use transcript, and we have successfully used groff compiled both with gcc 2.2.2 (on an HP 9000/720) and with AT&T cfront 2.1 (on an RS/6000). From the ATK FAQ: transcript (psdit) Contact: Adobe 1585 Charleston Road P.O. Box 7900 Mountain View, CA 94039-7900 phone: 1-800-833-6687 psroff (note that psroff doesn't allow printing of embedded postscript, used for rasters, zips, and in the next release figures.) Software augmenting troff and providing printer drivers. on cdrom: src/util/psroff is version 3.0 patch level 07 contact: Chris Lewis psroff-request@ferret.ocunix.on.ca GNU software: groff, g++, gcc, gdb, gnuemacs, ... Free software, eventually replacing Un*x ftp: prep.ai.mit.edu see pub/gnu/GNUinfo/FTP and pub/gnu/etc/DISTRIB email: gnu@prep.ai.mit.edu mailing address: Free Software Foundation, Inc. 675 Massachusetts Avenue Cambridge, MA 02139 USA phone: +1 617-876-3296 -Rob Ryan Andrew Consortium \enddata{text,270797428} \enddata{text822, 141340} \begindata{text822, 143849} Return-path: X-Andrew-Authenticated-as: 5904;andrew.cmu.edu;Robert Andrew Ryan Received: from po4.andrew.cmu.edu via trymail for info-andrew+@andrew.cmu.edu (->+dist+/afs/andrew.cmu.edu/usr0/ak99/dists/info-andrew-nostrip.dl) ID ; Wed, 18 Nov 1992 00:47:58 -0500 (EST) Received: from GS16.SP.CS.CMU.EDU via qmail ID ; Tue, 17 Nov 1992 10:56:25 -0500 (EST) Received: from Messages.8.5.N.CUILIB.3.45.SNAP.NOT.LINKED.GS16.SP.CS.CMU.EDU.rt.aos4 via MS.5.6.GS16.SP.CS.CMU.EDU.rt_aos4; Tue, 17 Nov 1992 10:56:24 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: Date: Tue, 17 Nov 1992 10:56:24 -0500 (EST) From: Robert Andrew Ryan To: Info-Andrew , cis.ohio-state.edu!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!uwm.edu!spool.mu.edu!umn.edu!lynx!draco.unm.edu!opus@UCBVAX.Berkeley.EDU (Colby Kraybill) Subject: Re: Printing, using groff, DEC MIPS... In-Reply-To: <88jq6zr@lynx.unm.edu> References: <88jq6zr@lynx.unm.edu> Excerpts from internet.other.info-andrew: 17-Nov-92 Printing, using groff, DEC .. Colby Kraybill@ucbvax.Be (835) > Here is the exact configuration of the stuff that I am using, > EZ Version 7.0, ATK 5.1 on a DEC MIPS 5000/120 running under X11 R5. > I am using groff version 1.05. > I've put in my global.prf: > *.formatcommand: groff -pte -E /tmp/%s.n | > *.PrintCommand: lpr -Pljea1 -Dpostscript I don'tr know what is wrong off hand. My best advice is to change the | to >&/tmp/print.log and see if any error messages are shown. Hope this helps, -Rob Ryan Andrew Consortium \enddata{text822, 143849} \begindata{text822, 145676} Return-path: X-Andrew-Authenticated-as: 5904;andrew.cmu.edu;Robert Andrew Ryan Received: from po4.andrew.cmu.edu via trymail for info-andrew+@andrew.cmu.edu (->+dist+/afs/andrew.cmu.edu/usr0/ak99/dists/info-andrew-nostrip.dl) ID ; Wed, 18 Nov 1992 00:48:25 -0500 (EST) Received: from GS16.SP.CS.CMU.EDU via qmail ID ; Tue, 17 Nov 1992 11:11:25 -0500 (EST) Received: from Messages.8.5.N.CUILIB.3.45.SNAP.NOT.LINKED.GS16.SP.CS.CMU.EDU.rt.aos4 via MS.5.6.GS16.SP.CS.CMU.EDU.rt_aos4; Tue, 17 Nov 1992 11:11:25 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: Date: Tue, 17 Nov 1992 11:11:25 -0500 (EST) From: Robert Andrew Ryan To: Info-Andrew , Bob Glickstein Subject: Re: Flakiness on SGI Indigo In-Reply-To: <9211162331.ZM27607@zindigo.z-code.com> References: <9211162331.ZM27607@zindigo.z-code.com> Excerpts from internet.other.info-andrew: 16-Nov-92 Flakiness on SGI Indigo Bob Glickstein@zindigo.z (830) > When reading text with a large inset visible, scrolling backwards via a right-click in the scrollbar sometimes causes a core dump. We have fixed some code wrt scrolling insets, but I don't think any core-dumps were fixed. Excerpts from internet.other.info-andrew: 16-Nov-92 Flakiness on SGI Indigo Bob Glickstein@zindigo.z (830) > And incidentally, how much has the source changed since the CD-ROM > release (I hesitate to ask)? Volume wise not a great deal, but quite a bit of change has ... Changes... Support for color images and colormaps is being built into im, graphic and view. Observable objects (text, buttons, views, etc...) are now refcounted (in such a way applications written before should generally continue to work without modification) Core leak fixes in xim Totally new stuff... Figure editor, replacing zip which has moved to contrib. Preferences editor. Color image inset Bison (the Andrew Consortium version), eventually to replace all use of yacc. atk/syntax (including Bison) is intended to provide parsing support so duplication of effort can be avoided among applications where it is useful to use lex/yacc. The above is entirely from memory it may or may not be complete or accurate. I imagine we will post an official list of changes with the announcement of the members only release later this month. -Rob Ryan Andrew Consortium \enddata{text822, 145676} \begindata{text822, 148319} Return-path: X-Andrew-Authenticated-as: 0;andrew.cmu.edu;Network-Mail Received: from po4.andrew.cmu.edu via trymail for info-andrew+@andrew.cmu.edu (->+dist+/afs/andrew.cmu.edu/usr0/ak99/dists/info-andrew-nostrip.dl) ID ; Wed, 18 Nov 1992 08:30:44 -0500 (EST) Received: from po5.andrew.cmu.edu via qmail ID ; Wed, 18 Nov 1992 08:29:10 -0500 (EST) Received: from ucbvax.Berkeley.EDU by po5.andrew.cmu.edu (5.54/3.15) id for info-andrew; Wed, 18 Nov 92 08:28:53 EST Received: by ucbvax.Berkeley.EDU (5.63/1.43) id AA27797; Wed, 18 Nov 92 05:20:13 -0800 Received: from USENET by ucbvax.Berkeley.EDU with netnews for info-andrew@andrew.cmu.edu (info-andrew@andrew.cmu.edu) (contact usenet@ucbvax.Berkeley.EDU if you have questions) Date: 17 Nov 92 16:22:42 GMT From: rr2b+@andrew.cmu.edu (Robert Andrew Ryan) Organization: School of Computer Science, Carnegie Mellon, Pittsburgh, PA Subject: Re: help with insets Message-Id: References: <1992Nov17.121739.8941@trl.oz.au> Sender: info-andrew-request@andrew.cmu.edu To: info-andrew@andrew.cmu.edu Excerpts from netnews.comp.soft-sys.andrew: 17-Nov-92 help with insets Brian Keck@castor.trl.OZ (828) > I'm a beginner at ez, zip, et al, & have got stuck. > I'm trying to insert (zip inset) a picture in a text file (ez). > It basically works, but I get too much white space. > I'm hoping someone can tell me how to avoid it. Unfortunately zip is not really designed for what most people want it for... It's primarily a hierarchical drawing editor/viewer. (Basically meaning that it lets you make/look at a drawing at various levels of detail.) To avoid the whitespace there are two things you must do. First , make the drawing occupy the entire visible space of the zip while the composition tools are in place. Second, resize the inset in browse mode until you are satisfied. (The month object apparently wants to be square(?)) Hope this helps, -Rob Ryan Andrew Consortium \enddata{text822, 148319} \begindata{text822, 150551} Return-path: X-Andrew-Authenticated-as: 0;andrew.cmu.edu;Network-Mail Received: from andrew.cmu.edu via trymail for info-andrew+@andrew.cmu.edu (->+dist+/afs/andrew.cmu.edu/usr0/ak99/dists/info-andrew-nostrip.dl) ID ; Wed, 18 Nov 1992 09:00:22 -0500 (EST) Received: from po5.andrew.cmu.edu via qmail ID ; Wed, 18 Nov 1992 08:58:58 -0500 (EST) Received: from ucbvax.Berkeley.EDU by po5.andrew.cmu.edu (5.54/3.15) id for info-andrew; Wed, 18 Nov 92 08:58:53 EST Received: by ucbvax.Berkeley.EDU (5.63/1.43) id AA29145; Wed, 18 Nov 92 05:56:20 -0800 Received: from USENET by ucbvax.Berkeley.EDU with netnews for info-andrew@andrew.cmu.edu (info-andrew@andrew.cmu.edu) (contact usenet@ucbvax.Berkeley.EDU if you have questions) Date: 17 Nov 92 22:39:01 GMT From: rr2b+@andrew.cmu.edu (Robert Andrew Ryan) Organization: School of Computer Science, Carnegie Mellon, Pittsburgh, PA Subject: Re: message queue with ATK Message-Id: References: <1992Nov17.163509.662@csi.uottawa.ca> Sender: info-andrew-request@andrew.cmu.edu To: info-andrew@andrew.cmu.edu Excerpts from netnews.comp.soft-sys.andrew: 17-Nov-92 message queue with ATK Isabelle Tourneux@shamin (691) > - is it possible to use the usual msgrcv and msgsnd in an > infinite loop ? I have tried to put an infinite loop in the > "controller_go" of an Adew view-controller, but it disturbs the > usual functionnning of the controller. Yes, the normal function of an interactive ATK function assumes that the event loop in im/xim is run whenever waiting for input. You could peek into the internals of im and xim, and add the appropriate select call and then call im_Interact(FALSE) if there is input for im. I'm not very familiar with message queues, as far as I can tell the only way to know when a message has arrived is to be waiting for it, or to poll continually. Excerpts from netnews.comp.soft-sys.andrew: 17-Nov-92 message queue with ATK Isabelle Tourneux@shamin (691) > - does an object-oriented function (a sort of "im_AddMessageQueue") > exist to set an input handler when something arrives on a > message queue, just as it does for sockets in im_AddFileHandler ? No. Adding such a function might be quite difficult. You could use im_EnqueueEvent to periodically poll a message queue, but this could hurt performance substantially. In an environment without threads I don't see how message queues make sense to use. (Though some of their features are certianly useful.) If the main feature you're looking for is access control via the permission bits, then a unix domain socket, or fifo might be better than message queues for use with ATK. -Rob \enddata{text822, 150551} \begindata{text822, 153480} Return-path: X-Andrew-Authenticated-as: 0;andrew.cmu.edu;Network-Mail Received: from andrew.cmu.edu via trymail for info-andrew+@andrew.cmu.edu (->+dist+/afs/andrew.cmu.edu/usr0/ak99/dists/info-andrew-nostrip.dl) ID ; Wed, 18 Nov 1992 09:54:12 -0500 (EST) Received: from po3.andrew.cmu.edu via qmail ID ; Wed, 18 Nov 1992 09:52:22 -0500 (EST) Received: from vnet.ibm.com by po3.andrew.cmu.edu (5.54/3.15) id for info-andrew; Wed, 18 Nov 92 09:52:09 EST Received: from RCHLAND by vnet.ibm.com (IBM VM SMTP V2R2) with BSMTP id 1348; Wed, 18 Nov 92 09:49:46 EST Reply-To: "Todd Inglett" Received: by po1.rchland.ibm.com (5.51/4.7) id for info-andrew@andrew.cmu.edu; Wed, 18 Nov 92 08:48:49 CST Received: via switchmail; Wed, 18 Nov 1992 08:48:46 -0600 (CST) Received: from q.rchland.ibm.com via qmail ID ; Wed, 18 Nov 1992 08:48:12 -0600 (CST) Received: from q.rchland.ibm.com via qmail ID ; Wed, 18 Nov 1992 08:48:10 -0600 (CST) Received: from Messages.8.5.N.CUILIB.3.45.SNAP.NOT.LINKED.q.rchland.ibm.com.rs.aix32 via MS.5.6.q.rchland.ibm.com.rs_aix32; Wed, 18 Nov 1992 08:48:09 -0600 (CST) Message-Id: Date: Wed, 18 Nov 1992 08:48:09 -0600 (CST) From: Todd Inglett X-Andrew-Message-Size: 1882+0 Content-Type: X-BE2; 12 If-Type-Unsupported: send To: info-andrew@andrew.cmu.edu Subject: Re: message queue with ATK In-Reply-To: <1992Nov17.234622.5623@adobe.com> References: <1992Nov17.163509.662@csi.uottawa.ca> <1992Nov17.234622.5623@adobe.com> \begindata{text,538998008} \textdsversion{12} \template{messages} \define{keyword } \excerptedcaption{Excerpts from ext.misc.info-andrew: 17-Nov-92 Re: message queue with ATK Zalman Stern@decwrl.dec. (1573)} \quotation{The namespace for System V message queues is disjoint from the file }\quotation{descriptor namespace. They do not work with select and hence do not fit into }\quotation{ATK interaction model.} This may be true in general, but be sure to look closely at the \italic{select} call on your system. In AIX, for example, the first argument to select indicates how many file descriptors and message queues are specified in the other arguments. The lower 16 bits of the first argument specify the # of files and the upper 16 bits specify the # of message queues. Because it would be impossible to specify 64535 file descriptors (AIX has a limit of around 2000 or so), it is completely compatible with the `old' select. Still, this means that you must modify ATK at a very low level. In particular, you must add at least two new class procedures to atk/basics/common/im.ch and their implementations in im.c: \example{AddMsgQHandler(int msgqid, procedure proc, char *procdata, long priority) returns boolean; RemoveMsgQHandler(int msgqid); } You will have to add an array of MsgQHandlers to the struct im_GlobalDataType (scroll down in im.ch), and write the two new class procedures to add/remove the handlers from this MsgQHandlers list. Finally, you must modify \bold{xim__HandleFiles} in atk/basics/x/xim.c so that the select system call is given the appropriate arguments. This code is a little tricky, but with a little persistence I am sure you can get it to work. Now your ADEW application can call \bold{im_AddMsgQHandler} to setup a callback whenever input arrives from the queue. But remember, this will only work if your select supports \italic{both} queues and file descriptors. If your select doesn't support message queues, how about the \italic{poll} system call (if you have one)? It could be used in place of select. -todd inglett \enddata{text,538998008} \enddata{text822, 153480} \begindata{text822, 157593} Return-path: X-Andrew-Authenticated-as: 0;andrew.cmu.edu;Network-Mail Received: from po5.andrew.cmu.edu via trymail for info-andrew+@andrew.cmu.edu (->+dist+/afs/andrew.cmu.edu/usr0/ak99/dists/info-andrew-nostrip.dl) ID ; Wed, 18 Nov 1992 15:37:55 -0500 (EST) Received: from po3.andrew.cmu.edu via qmail ID ; Wed, 18 Nov 1992 15:34:08 -0500 (EST) Received: from sun2.nsfnet-relay.ac.uk by po3.andrew.cmu.edu (5.54/3.15) id for info-andrew; Wed, 18 Nov 92 15:33:47 EST Via: uk.ac.bbk.dcs; Wed, 18 Nov 1992 14:19:21 +0000 Via: dcs.bbk.ac.uk; Wed, 18 Nov 92 14:10:54 GMT Received: from localhost by zeta (4.1/SMI-4.1) id AA04308; Wed, 18 Nov 92 14:12:44 GMT To: info-andrew@andrew.cmu.edu From: Pete Newson Subject: Organisation: Department of Computer Science, Birkbeck College Postal-Address: Malet Street, London WC1E 7HX, England Phone-No: +44 71 631 6351 Fax-No: +44 71 636 4971 X-Mailer: MH Version 6.6 Date: Wed, 18 Nov 92 14:12:43 +0000 Message-Id: <4307.722095963@zeta> Sender: ubac1ee@dcs.bbk.ac.uk Hi I have been trying to use the Andrew Remote Demo service using: finger help@atk.ic.cmu.edu but finger just times out. Is there a known problem with the server? Pete Newson \enddata{text822, 157593} \begindata{text822, 159084} Return-path: X-Andrew-Authenticated-as: 0;andrew.cmu.edu;Network-Mail Received: from po5.andrew.cmu.edu via trymail for info-andrew+@andrew.cmu.edu (->+dist+/afs/andrew.cmu.edu/usr0/ak99/dists/info-andrew-nostrip.dl) ID ; Thu, 19 Nov 1992 12:31:57 -0500 (EST) Received: from po5.andrew.cmu.edu via qmail ID ; Thu, 19 Nov 1992 12:30:30 -0500 (EST) Received: from ucbvax.Berkeley.EDU by po5.andrew.cmu.edu (5.54/3.15) id for info-andrew; Thu, 19 Nov 92 12:30:11 EST Received: by ucbvax.Berkeley.EDU (5.63/1.43) id AA01112; Thu, 19 Nov 92 09:26:36 -0800 Received: from USENET by ucbvax.Berkeley.EDU with netnews for info-andrew@andrew.cmu.edu (info-andrew@andrew.cmu.edu) (contact usenet@ucbvax.Berkeley.EDU if you have questions) Date: 18 Nov 92 01:23:16 GMT From: auspex-gw!guy@uunet.uu.net (Guy Harris) Organization: Auspex Systems, Santa Clara Subject: Re: message queue with ATK Message-Id: <15537@auspex-gw.auspex.com> References: <1992Nov17.163509.662@csi.uottawa.ca>, <1992Nov17.234622.5623@adobe.com> Sender: info-andrew-request@andrew.cmu.edu To: info-andrew@andrew.cmu.edu >Or if you have SysVr4, you might try putmsg and getmsg on streams On what *kind* of streams? (I.e., STREAMS is a general framework; to do IPC on top of it, you need some particular thing that plugs into that framework. There's probably something in SVR4 that'll do....) >but I'm not sure how that stuff interacts with select. "select()", in SVR4, is implemented atop "poll()", so anything that supports "poll()" - which should include anything implemented atop STREAMS - should work with "select()", modulo bugs in the "select()" implementation. \enddata{text822, 159084} \begindata{text822, 160988} Return-path: X-Andrew-Authenticated-as: 0;andrew.cmu.edu;Network-Mail Received: from andrew.cmu.edu via trymail for info-andrew+@andrew.cmu.edu (->+dist+/afs/andrew.cmu.edu/usr0/ak99/dists/info-andrew-nostrip.dl) ID ; Thu, 19 Nov 1992 17:17:18 -0500 (EST) Received: from andrew.cmu.edu via qmail ID ; Thu, 19 Nov 1992 17:14:36 -0500 (EST) Received: from JAGUAR.BOLTZ.CS.CMU.EDU by andrew.cmu.edu (5.54/3.15) id for info-andrew+; Thu, 19 Nov 92 17:14:22 EST Received: by JAGUAR.BOLTZ.CS.CMU.EDU (AIX 3.2/UCB 5.64/4.03) id AA21490; Thu, 19 Nov 1992 17:10:30 -0500 Received: from Messages.8.5.N.CUILIB.3.45.SNAP.NOT.LINKED.jaguar.boltz.cs.cmu.edu.rs.aix31 via MS.5.6.jaguar.boltz.cs.cmu.edu.rs_aix31; Thu, 19 Nov 1992 17:10:30 -0500 (EST) Message-Id: Date: Thu, 19 Nov 1992 17:10:30 -0500 (EST) From: Ricky Houghton To: Info-Andrew Subject: Flames examples Can someone provide a sample ~/.AMS.flames file that does simple mail sorting? Also, is there documentation other than the FLAMES reference manual? Automatic mail is almost a necessity. Thanks, Ricky \enddata{text822, 160988} \begindata{text822, 162430} Return-path: X-Andrew-Authenticated-as: 0;andrew.cmu.edu;Network-Mail Received: from po5.andrew.cmu.edu via trymail for info-andrew+@andrew.cmu.edu (->+dist+/afs/andrew.cmu.edu/usr0/ak99/dists/info-andrew-nostrip.dl) ID ; Fri, 20 Nov 1992 09:42:12 -0500 (EST) Received: from andrew.cmu.edu via qmail ID ; Fri, 20 Nov 1992 09:40:22 -0500 (EST) If-Type-Unsupported: send Received: from po3.andrew.cmu.edu via qmail ID ; Fri, 20 Nov 1992 09:37:14 -0500 (EST) Received: from thumper.bellcore.com by po3.andrew.cmu.edu (5.54/3.15) id for info-andrew+; Fri, 20 Nov 92 09:37:09 EST Received: from greenbush.bellcore.com by thumper.bellcore.com (4.1/4.7) id for info-andrew+@andrew.cmu.edu; Fri, 20 Nov 92 09:36:34 EST Received: by greenbush.bellcore.com (4.1/4.7) id for houghton+@cs.cmu.edu; Fri, 20 Nov 92 09:36:33 EST Received: from Messages.8.5.N.CUILIB.3.45.SNAP.NOT.LINKED.greenbush.galaxy.sun4.41 via MS.5.6.greenbush.galaxy.sun4_41; Fri, 20 Nov 1992 09:36:32 -0500 (EST) Message-Id: <8f3DTk20M2YtMwy7xv@thumper.bellcore.com> Date: Fri, 20 Nov 1992 09:36:32 -0500 (EST) From: Nathaniel Borenstein Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII To: Info-Andrew Subject: Re: Flames examples Cc: Ricky Houghton In-Reply-To: References: I assume the programmer manual you refer to is $ANDREWDIR/doc/ams/Flames.pgr. For a gentler introduction, try the help file -- $ANDREWDIR/help/flames.help. It has several examples of the kind you might want. If that's not enough for you, I can send you some really complex examples, but not TOO many simple ones... -- Nathaniel \enddata{text822, 162430} \begindata{text822, 164547} Return-path: X-Andrew-Authenticated-as: 1210;alw.nih.gov;Bob Dew Received: from spot.dcrt.nih.gov via trymail for info-andrew+@andrew.cmu.edu (->+dist+/afs/andrew.cmu.edu/usr0/ak99/dists/info-andrew-nostrip.dl) (->+dist+/afs/andrew.cmu.edu/usr0/ak99/dists/info-andrew-nostrip.dl@andrew.cmu.edu) ID ; Fri, 20 Nov 1992 15:08:06 -0500 (EST) Received: from kirin.dcrt.nih.gov via qmail ID ; Fri, 20 Nov 1992 15:06:44 -0500 (EST) If-Type-Unsupported: send Received: from spot.dcrt.nih.gov via qmail ID ; Fri, 20 Nov 1992 15:05:56 -0500 (EST) Received: from dude.dcrt.nih.gov via qmail ID ; Fri, 20 Nov 1992 15:05:14 -0500 (EST) Received: from dude.dcrt.nih.gov via qmail ID ; Fri, 20 Nov 1992 15:05:06 -0500 (EST) Received: from Messages.8.5.N.CUILIB.3.45.SNAP.NOT.LINKED.dude.dcrt.nih.gov.sun4c.411 via MS.5.6.dude.dcrt.nih.gov.sun4_41; Fri, 20 Nov 1992 15:05:05 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: Date: Fri, 20 Nov 1992 15:05:05 -0500 (EST) From: Bob Dew MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII To: Info-Andrew Subject: AMDS race condition? We've upgraded our two AMDS postoffice machines from RTs to SPARCstation2s, and ever since we've experienced a rash of duplicate message deliveries; that is, a single message deposited in a queue gets delivered twice, presumably once by one postoffice daemon, and again by the other. Our postoffice configuration hasn't changed since switching to the SPARCstations. The only difference is that the SPARCs run about a billion times, well 10,000 times, faster than the RTS. Could faster mail queue processing somehow account for the significant increase we've seen in duplicate message deliveries? I'd think that race conditions, where two daemons act on the same queue simultaneously, would occur less frequently with the faster postoffice servers. Thanks, Bob \enddata{text822, 164547} \begindata{text822, 166950} X-Andrew-Authenticated-As: 469;andrew.cmu.edu;Craig F. Everhart Return-path: X-Andrew-Authenticated-as: 1312;transarc.com;Craig Everhart Received: from mobius via trymail for info-andrew+@andrew.cmu.edu (->+dist+/afs/andrew.cmu.edu/usr0/ak99/dists/info-andrew-nostrip.dl) (->+dist+/afs/andrew.cmu.edu/usr0/ak99/dists/info-andrew-nostrip.dl@andrew.cmu.edu) ID ; Fri, 20 Nov 1992 16:52:11 -0500 (EST) If-Type-Unsupported: send Received: from mobius via qmail ID ; Fri, 20 Nov 1992 16:49:09 -0500 (EST) Received: from Messages.7.14.N.CUILIB.3.45.SNAP.NOT.LINKED.mobius.sun4.40 via MS.5.6.mobius.sun4_40; Fri, 20 Nov 1992 16:49:06 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <8f3JpGCSMUQ=Q5FGlp@transarc.com> Date: Fri, 20 Nov 1992 16:49:06 -0500 (EST) From: Craig_Everhart@transarc.com X-Andrew-Message-Size: 388+0 Content-Type: X-BE2; 12 To: Info-Andrew , Bob Dew Subject: Re: AMDS race condition? In-Reply-To: References: \begindata{text,3452080} \textdsversion{12} \template{messages} I don't think that there's an AMDS race, but I've seen these duplicates as well. There's an flock() held on one of the queued files--the GF.* file, I think--for the duration of the delivery. Or at least there's supposed to be. Having mail occasionally delivered twice seemed to be not much of a problem, but more of a curiosity. Good luck if you intend to pursue it further. Craig \enddata{text,3452080} \enddata{text822, 166950} \begindata{text822, 168725} Return-path: X-Andrew-Authenticated-as: 0;andrew.cmu.edu;Network-Mail Received: from andrew.cmu.edu via trymail for info-andrew+@andrew.cmu.edu (->+dist+/afs/andrew.cmu.edu/usr0/ak99/dists/info-andrew-nostrip.dl) ID ; Sat, 21 Nov 1992 20:49:10 -0500 (EST) Received: from po5.andrew.cmu.edu via qmail ID ; Sat, 21 Nov 1992 20:46:59 -0500 (EST) Received: from ucbvax.Berkeley.EDU by po5.andrew.cmu.edu (5.54/3.15) id for info-andrew; Sat, 21 Nov 92 20:46:45 EST Received: by ucbvax.Berkeley.EDU (5.63/1.43) id AA06036; Sat, 21 Nov 92 17:41:01 -0800 Received: from USENET by ucbvax.Berkeley.EDU with netnews for info-andrew@andrew.cmu.edu (info-andrew@andrew.cmu.edu) (contact usenet@ucbvax.Berkeley.EDU if you have questions) Date: 18 Nov 92 19:35:47 GMT From: adobe!usenet@decwrl.dec.com (Zalman Stern) Organization: Adobe Systems Incorporated Subject: Re: message queue with ATK Message-Id: <1992Nov18.193547.27977@adobe.com> References: Sender: info-andrew-request@andrew.cmu.edu To: info-andrew@andrew.cmu.edu In article tinglett+@rchland.ibm.com (Todd Inglett) writes: > Excerpts from ext.misc.info-andrew: 17-Nov-92 Re: messagequeue with ATK > Zalman Stern@decwrl.dec. (1573) > > > The namespace for System V message queues is disjoint from the file > > descriptor namespace. They do not work with select and hence donot fit into > ATK interaction model. > > This may be true in general, but be sure to look closely at the > selectcall on your system. In AIX, for example, the first argument to > selectindicates how many file descriptors and message queues are > specified in theother arguments. The lower 16 bits of the first > argument specify the # offiles and the upper 16 bits specify the # of > message queues. Because it wouldbe impossible to specify 64535 file > descriptors (AIX has a limit of around2000 or so), it is completely > compatible with the `old' select. It is best to ignore braindamage like this. Shooting the person responsible might make you feel better, but is generally not worth the consequences. -- Zalman Stern zalman@adobe.com (415) 962 3824 Adobe Systems, 1585 Charleston Rd., POB 7900, Mountain View, CA 94039-7900 "Yeah. Ask 'em if they'll upgrade my shifters too." Bill Watterson \enddata{text822, 168725} \begindata{text822, 171312} Return-path: X-Andrew-Authenticated-as: 0;andrew.cmu.edu;Network-Mail Received: from po5.andrew.cmu.edu via trymail for info-andrew+@andrew.cmu.edu (->+dist+/afs/andrew.cmu.edu/usr0/ak99/dists/info-andrew-nostrip.dl) ID ; Mon, 23 Nov 1992 04:36:54 -0500 (EST) Received: from po5.andrew.cmu.edu via qmail ID ; Mon, 23 Nov 1992 04:35:15 -0500 (EST) Received: from ucbvax.Berkeley.EDU by po5.andrew.cmu.edu (5.54/3.15) id for info-andrew; Mon, 23 Nov 92 04:35:07 EST Received: by ucbvax.Berkeley.EDU (5.63/1.43) id AA25971; Mon, 23 Nov 92 01:31:18 -0800 Received: from USENET by ucbvax.Berkeley.EDU with netnews for info-andrew@andrew.cmu.edu (info-andrew@andrew.cmu.edu) (contact usenet@ucbvax.Berkeley.EDU if you have questions) Date: 17 Nov 92 16:35:09 GMT From: dog.ee.lbl.gov!pasteur!agate!spool.mu.edu!uwm.edu!cs.utexas.edu!torn!nott!cunews!csi.uottawa.ca!news@ucbvax.Berkeley.EDU (Isabelle Tourneux) Organization: MCRLab - University of Ottawa Subject: message queue with ATK Message-Id: <1992Nov17.163509.662@csi.uottawa.ca> Sender: info-andrew-request@andrew.cmu.edu To: info-andrew@andrew.cmu.edu I would like to use message queues with ATK and ADEW. - is it possible to use the usual msgrcv and msgsnd in an infinite loop ? I have tried to put an infinite loop in the "controller_go" of an Adew view-controller, but it disturbs the usual functionnning of the controller. - does an object-oriented function (a sort of "im_AddMessageQueue") exist to set an input handler when something arrives on a message queue, just as it does for sockets in im_AddFileHandler ? In short, is there a way I can use message queues, or can I use only sockets to communicate with other processes ? Thanks Isabelle Tourneux Multimedia Lab of the University of Ottawa, isabelle@shamin.genie.uottawa.ca \enddata{text822, 171312} \begindata{text822, 173378} Return-path: X-Andrew-Authenticated-as: 0;andrew.cmu.edu;Network-Mail Received: from po2.andrew.cmu.edu via trymail for info-andrew+@andrew.cmu.edu (->+dist+/afs/andrew.cmu.edu/usr0/ak99/dists/info-andrew-nostrip.dl) ID ; Mon, 23 Nov 1992 13:33:49 -0500 (EST) Received: from po3.andrew.cmu.edu via qmail ID ; Mon, 23 Nov 1992 13:31:32 -0500 (EST) Received: from LOAN1.SP.CS.CMU.EDU by po3.andrew.cmu.edu (5.54/3.15) id for wjh+; Mon, 23 Nov 92 13:31:18 EST Received: from Messages.8.5.N.CUILIB.3.45.SNAP.NOT.LINKED.LOAN1.SP.CS.CMU.EDU.sun4.mach via MS.5.6.LOAN1.SP.CS.CMU.EDU.sun4_mach; Mon, 23 Nov 1992 13:31:11 -0500 (EST) Message-Id: <4f4GBjy00gpmAES2Ag@cs.cmu.edu> Date: Mon, 23 Nov 1992 13:31:11 -0500 (EST) From: Wilfred.Hansen@cs.cmu.edu To: Info-Andrew Subject: removal of lex, lexdef, buildy, and reyacc Fed up at last with porting to various perverse versions of yacc, I have indulged myself by coding up new parsing tools--replacements for yac and lex. The important question is whether we can delete the existing tools or whether users have dependencies on them. The replaced tools have been in source directories atk/ness/tokens and contrib/parsegen. They include lex and lexdef which were the lexical analyzer used by ness bulidy and reyacc which were tools for simplifying parser construction using yacc lexorgen and parsergen which were similar tools for bdffont If anyone has dependencies on these tools please say so soon. The new tools are a revised version of bison which generates tables without a parser attached a 'parse' object which utlizes the tables from bison 'gentlex' -- a processor of lexeme descriptions which is tied to the bison tables the 'tlex' object which which utilizes the tables produced by gentlex. The new bison/parse/gentlex/tlex tools have a number of advantages: o Applications may have multiple grammars without multiple copies of the parser code. o Reserved words are handled automatically and need not be listed both in the grammar and the lexeme description. o Multiple character symbols like "<=" or "->" may appear directly in the grammar. o Lexeme streams for typical programming languages are easily described. o The 'sym' object provides symbol tables. o It is as easy to parse text with ATK styles as plain ASCII text. Fred Hansen \enddata{text822, 173378} \begindata{text822, 176012} Return-path: X-Andrew-Authenticated-as: 0;andrew.cmu.edu;Network-Mail Received: from po2.andrew.cmu.edu via trymail for info-andrew+@andrew.cmu.edu (->+dist+/afs/andrew.cmu.edu/usr0/ak99/dists/info-andrew-nostrip.dl) ID ; Mon, 23 Nov 1992 13:36:32 -0500 (EST) Received: from po3.andrew.cmu.edu via qmail ID ; Mon, 23 Nov 1992 13:34:34 -0500 (EST) Received: from LOAN1.SP.CS.CMU.EDU by po3.andrew.cmu.edu (5.54/3.15) id for wjh+; Mon, 23 Nov 92 13:34:21 EST Received: from Messages.8.5.N.CUILIB.3.45.SNAP.NOT.LINKED.LOAN1.SP.CS.CMU.EDU.sun4.mach via MS.5.6.LOAN1.SP.CS.CMU.EDU.sun4_mach; Mon, 23 Nov 1992 13:33:51 -0500 (EST) Message-Id: Date: Mon, 23 Nov 1992 13:33:51 -0500 (EST) From: Wilfred.Hansen@cs.cmu.edu To: Info-Andrew Subject: redefinition of ^ in Ness strings For a while, now, the ^ character followed by an upper case letter in a Ness string haws been interpreted as a control character. (^A meaning 0x01, for instance). This has come to seem like a bad idea. The proposed change is to use \^ followed by a letter to mean the control character. If anyone has Ness code that uses ^ with the old meaning, please let us know. Thanks, Fred Hansen \enddata{text822, 176012} \begindata{text822, 177523} Return-path: X-Andrew-Authenticated-as: 0;andrew.cmu.edu;Network-Mail Received: from po2.andrew.cmu.edu via trymail for info-andrew+@andrew.cmu.edu (->+dist+/afs/andrew.cmu.edu/usr0/ak99/dists/info-andrew-nostrip.dl) ID ; Mon, 23 Nov 1992 19:50:00 -0500 (EST) Received: from po2.andrew.cmu.edu via qmail ID ; Mon, 23 Nov 1992 19:47:57 -0500 (EST) If-Type-Unsupported: send Received: from po5.andrew.cmu.edu via qmail ID ; Mon, 23 Nov 1992 19:46:13 -0500 (EST) Received: from linhnam.trl.OZ.AU by po5.andrew.cmu.edu (5.54/3.15) id for info-andrew; Mon, 23 Nov 92 19:45:52 EST Received: by linhnam.trl.OZ.AU id AA20946 (5.65c/IDA-1.4.4 for info-andrew@andrew.cmu.edu); Tue, 24 Nov 1992 11:45:41 +1100 Received: from Messages.8.5.N.CUILIB.3.45.SNAP.NOT.LINKED.linhnam..trl.OZ.AU.sun4.41 via MS.5.6.linhnam..trl.OZ.AU.sun4_41; Tue, 24 Nov 1992 11:45:40 +1100 (EST) Message-Id: Date: Tue, 24 Nov 1992 11:45:40 +1100 (EST) From: Khanh Ly Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII To: info-andrew@andrew.cmu.edu Subject: AMS header help Cc: k.ly@trl.oz.au Hi, I am using AMS (messages 8.5 from CD Rom disk, rel. 5.1) frequently and quite happy with their MIME support. However, there is one trivial ? problem. The people receive my email cannot reply to me if they didn't correct the header. It seems the AMS put one more period in my email address. For example: we got from: khanh@linhnam..trl.oz.au I can receive email normaly if the alias address is k.ly@trl.oz.au. My platform is Sparcstation SLC, Sun OS 4.1.1 and Openwindow 3.0 and NFS (unfortunately, no AFS). I have not got this problem with elm, mailtool. Do I miss something in preferences files ? Help Please. Regards ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- ---------- Khanh Ly Email k.ly@trl.oz.au Tel +61 3 253 6122 Fax +61 3 253 6144 Switched Networks Branch, Telecom Australia Research Laboratories P.O. Box 249, Clayton, Victoria 3168, AUSTRALIA. \enddata{text822, 177523} \begindata{text822, 179971} Return-path: X-Andrew-Authenticated-as: 0;andrew.cmu.edu;Network-Mail Received: from po2.andrew.cmu.edu via trymail for info-andrew+@andrew.cmu.edu (->+dist+/afs/andrew.cmu.edu/usr0/ak99/dists/info-andrew-nostrip.dl) ID ; Tue, 24 Nov 1992 02:55:09 -0500 (EST) Received: from po3.andrew.cmu.edu via qmail ID ; Tue, 24 Nov 1992 02:54:08 -0500 (EST) Received: from wn1.sci.kun.nl by po3.andrew.cmu.edu (5.54/3.15) id for info-andrew; Tue, 24 Nov 92 02:53:55 EST Received: by wn1.sci.kun.nl (5.57/2.1) on NUNET id AA21775; Tue, 24 Nov 92 08:57:52 +0100 Received: from zeus by cs.kun.nl (4.1/SMI-3.2) id AA00444; Tue, 24 Nov 92 08:57:46 +0100 Received: from Messages.8.5.N.CUILIB.3.45.SNAP.NOT.LINKED.zeus.CS.kun.nl..sun4.41 via MS.5.6.zeus.CS.kun.nl..sun4_41; Tue, 24 Nov 1992 08:57:43 +0100 (MET) Message-Id: Date: Tue, 24 Nov 1992 08:57:43 +0100 (MET) From: Harco de Hilster X-Andrew-Message-Size: 1473+0 Content-Type: X-BE2; 12 If-Type-Unsupported: send To: info-andrew@andrew.cmu.edu, Khanh Ly Subject: Re: AMS header help Cc: k.ly@trl.oz.au In-Reply-To: References: \begindata{text,1762232} \textdsversion{12} \template{messages} \excerptedcaption{Excerpts from andrew.mailing-list: 24-Nov-92 AMS header help Khanh Ly X-Andrew-Authenticated-as: 0;andrew.cmu.edu;Network-Mail Received: from po2.andrew.cmu.edu via trymail for info-andrew+@andrew.cmu.edu (->+dist+/afs/andrew.cmu.edu/usr0/ak99/dists/info-andrew-nostrip.dl) ID ; Tue, 24 Nov 1992 11:32:51 -0500 (EST) Received: from po5.andrew.cmu.edu via qmail ID ; Tue, 24 Nov 1992 11:31:09 -0500 (EST) If-Type-Unsupported: send Received: from po5.andrew.cmu.edu via qmail ID ; Tue, 24 Nov 1992 11:26:47 -0500 (EST) Received: from relay1.UU.NET by po5.andrew.cmu.edu (5.54/3.15) id for info-andrew; Tue, 24 Nov 92 11:26:21 EST Received: from uunet.uu.net (via LOCALHOST.UU.NET) by relay1.UU.NET with SMTP (5.61/UUNET-internet-primary) id AA24312; Tue, 24 Nov 92 11:26:14 -0500 Received: from lupine.UUCP by uunet.uu.net with UUCP/RMAIL (queueing-rmail) id 112600.5760; Tue, 24 Nov 1992 11:26:00 EST Received: from porter. ncd.com by lupine.ncd.com (4.1/SMI-4.1) id AA02485; Tue, 24 Nov 92 07:57:44 PST Received: by porter. ncd.com (16.8/SMI-4.1) id AA11581; Tue, 24 Nov 92 07:59:36 -0800 Received: from Messages.8.5.N.CUILIB.3.45.SNAP.NOT.LINKED.porter.HP9000.705 via MS.5.6.porter.hp700; Tue, 24 Nov 1992 07:59:36 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <0f4Z5c0000000hD0M0@porter> Date: Tue, 24 Nov 1992 07:59:36 -0800 (PST) From: Kris Olander Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII To: info-andrew@andrew.cmu.edu Subject: UUCP style mail addresses in AMS What magic preference do I need to set so that mail addresses such as: uunet!4gen!info will work without generating a "Address validation error" It use to work without any problem. To send to any of the uunet addresses, I need to convert the address to user@foo.blah which is forwarded to uunet. -Kris Olander \enddata{text822, 183289} \begindata{text822, 185414} X-Andrew-Authenticated-As: 469;andrew.cmu.edu;Craig F. Everhart Return-path: X-Andrew-Authenticated-as: 1312;transarc.com;Craig Everhart Received: from mobius via trymail for info-andrew+@andrew.cmu.edu (->+dist+/afs/andrew.cmu.edu/usr0/ak99/dists/info-andrew-nostrip.dl) (->+dist+/afs/andrew.cmu.edu/usr0/ak99/dists/info-andrew-nostrip.dl@andrew.cmu.edu) ID ; Tue, 24 Nov 1992 13:02:48 -0500 (EST) If-Type-Unsupported: send Received: from mobius via qmail ID ; Tue, 24 Nov 1992 13:00:06 -0500 (EST) Received: from Messages.7.14.N.CUILIB.3.45.SNAP.NOT.LINKED.mobius.sun4.40 via MS.5.6.mobius.sun4_40; Tue, 24 Nov 1992 13:00:04 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: Date: Tue, 24 Nov 1992 13:00:04 -0500 (EST) From: Craig_Everhart@transarc.com X-Andrew-Message-Size: 137+0 Content-Type: X-BE2; 12 To: Info-Andrew , Kris Olander Subject: Re: UUCP style mail addresses in AMS In-Reply-To: <0f4Z5c0000000hD0M0@porter> References: <0f4Z5c0000000hD0M0@porter> \begindata{text,3025800} \textdsversion{12} \template{messages} Anohter AndrewSetup option. Something like ``AMS_UUCPSupported: yes''. The AndrewSetup help file really does talk about this. Craig \enddata{text,3025800} \enddata{text822, 185414} \begindata{text822, 186948} Return-path: X-Andrew-Authenticated-as: 0;andrew.cmu.edu;Network-Mail Received: from po5.andrew.cmu.edu via trymail for info-andrew+@andrew.cmu.edu (->+dist+/afs/andrew.cmu.edu/usr0/ak99/dists/info-andrew-nostrip.dl) ID ; Tue, 24 Nov 1992 15:46:45 -0500 (EST) Received: from po5.andrew.cmu.edu via qmail ID ; Tue, 24 Nov 1992 15:44:53 -0500 (EST) Received: from nkosi.well.sf.ca.us by po5.andrew.cmu.edu (5.54/3.15) id for info-andrew; Tue, 24 Nov 92 15:44:31 EST Received: from well.sf.ca.us by nkosi.well.sf.ca.us (5.65c/SMI-4.1/nkosi-921112-1) id AA24541; Tue, 24 Nov 1992 12:45:56 -0800 Received: by well.sf.ca.us (5.65c/SMI-4.1/well-921112-2) id AA18778; Tue, 24 Nov 1992 12:43:30 -0800 Received: from zindigo by z-code.com (4.1/NBN-16/ZC-7) id AA18188; Tue, 24 Nov 92 12:19:05 PST Received: by zindigo (920330.SGI/920502.SGI) for @z-code.z-code.com:andrew.cmu.edu!info-andrew id AA01876; Tue, 24 Nov 92 12:21:20 -0800 From: bobg@zindigo.z-code.com (Bob Glickstein) Message-Id: <9211241221.ZM1874@zindigo.z-code.com> Date: Tue, 24 Nov 1992 12:21:20 -0800 Organization: Z-Code Software Corp., Marin County, CA Reply-To: Bob Glickstein X-Face: =($SY|/2Odk(K$UOYYH88u8x@sP9c'l[^RZwSi<=~B9w.bD}Xueurgex5p1D:0')q.qr8iC%%|X5/3)Fyw-_/+i2V29(;~Rgf.@|7qE,<,cz_3V)c1OZ\yZj'f:QRM=9EqQ?\v&apsKCVfLuQ$46j!B,WJ"~/,A-+KjI;0j7ymyLC5j3gBm} X-Mailer: Z-Mail (2.1.0 10/27/92) To: info-andrew@andrew.cmu.edu Subject: Minor Parsec bug Boy, you never know what you'll discover when you're browsing some of your old code. In my case, I was browsing support.c in andrew/overhead/parsec and discovered the following bug: At or near line 37, in the function PreWalkTree, the code looks like this: result = (*func) (node, depth, &descend, parentVal); if (descend && PC_IsProductionNode(node)) for (i = 0; i < PC_NumChildren(node); ++i) (void) PreWalkTree(PC_Child(node, i), func, depth + 1, result, i); Well, func is supposed to be a pointer to a function of five arguments, not four (c.f. the long comment preceding the definition of PreWalkTree). The fifth argument is supposed to tell func which child of its parent "node" is. That information is present as the whichChild argument to PreWalkTree. The first line mentioned above should therefore be changed to result = (*func) (node, depth, &descend, parentVal, whichChild); This is clearly a serious bug for anyone depending on PC_PreWalkTree working as advertised, however I call it a minor bug because I'll bet no one does depend on it. -- Bob Glickstein Z-Code Software Corp. 4340 Redwood Highway Suite B-50 San Rafael, CA 94903 (415) 499-8649 \enddata{text822, 186948} \begindata{text822, 189869} Return-path: X-Andrew-Authenticated-as: 5904;andrew.cmu.edu;Robert Andrew Ryan Received: from rascal.andrew.cmu.edu via trymail for info-andrew+@andrew.cmu.edu (->+dist+/afs/andrew.cmu.edu/usr0/ak99/dists/info-andrew-nostrip.dl) ID ; Tue, 24 Nov 1992 16:23:11 -0500 (EST) Received: from rascal.andrew.cmu.edu via qmail ID ; Tue, 24 Nov 1992 16:22:05 -0500 (EST) Received: from Messages.8.5.N.CUILIB.3.45.SNAP.NOT.LINKED.rascal.andrew.cmu.edu.rs.aix31 via MS.5.6.rascal.andrew.cmu.edu.rs_aix31; Tue, 24 Nov 1992 16:22:03 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: Date: Tue, 24 Nov 1992 16:22:03 -0500 (EST) From: Robert Andrew Ryan X-Andrew-Message-Size: 478+0 Content-Type: X-BE2; 12 If-Type-Unsupported: send To: Info-Andrew Subject: Re: Minor Parsec bug In-Reply-To: <9211241221.ZM1874@zindigo.z-code.com> References: <9211241221.ZM1874@zindigo.z-code.com> \begindata{text,538701952} \textdsversion{12} \template{messages} \excerptedcaption{Excerpts from internet.other.info-andrew: 24-Nov-92 Minor Parsec bug Bob Glickstein@zindigo.z (1206)} \quotation{Boy, you never know what you'll discover when you're browsing some of your old code. In my case, I was browsing support.c in }\quotation{andrew/overhead/parsec and discovered the following bug: } Thanks for the info, currently the code doesn't get built. Does anyone depend on parsec? (It parses original K&R C to an internal parse tree representation.) -Rob Ryan Andrew Consortium \ \enddata{text,538701952} \enddata{text822, 189869} \begindata{text822, 191700} Return-path: X-Andrew-Authenticated-as: 0;andrew.cmu.edu;Network-Mail Received: from po4.andrew.cmu.edu via trymail for info-andrew+@andrew.cmu.edu (->+dist+/afs/andrew.cmu.edu/usr0/ak99/dists/info-andrew-nostrip.dl) ID ; Tue, 24 Nov 1992 17:46:53 -0500 (EST) Received: from po5.andrew.cmu.edu via qmail ID ; Tue, 24 Nov 1992 17:44:30 -0500 (EST) Received: from nkosi.well.sf.ca.us by po5.andrew.cmu.edu (5.54/3.15) id for rr2b+; Tue, 24 Nov 92 17:44:03 EST Received: from well.sf.ca.us by nkosi.well.sf.ca.us (5.65c/SMI-4.1/nkosi-921112-1) id AA28705; Tue, 24 Nov 1992 14:45:36 -0800 Received: by well.sf.ca.us (5.65c/SMI-4.1/well-921112-2) id AA17374; Tue, 24 Nov 1992 14:43:13 -0800 Received: from zindigo by z-code.com (4.1/NBN-16/ZC-7) id AA18772; Tue, 24 Nov 92 14:22:02 PST Received: by zindigo (920330.SGI/920502.SGI) for @z-code.z-code.com:andrew.cmu.edu!info-andrew+ id AA02070; Tue, 24 Nov 92 14:24:17 -0800 From: bobg@zindigo.z-code.com (Bob Glickstein) Message-Id: <9211241424.ZM2068@zindigo.z-code.com> Date: Tue, 24 Nov 1992 14:24:16 -0800 In-Reply-To: Robert Andrew Ryan "Re: Minor Parsec bug" (Nov 24, 4:22pm) References: <9211241221.ZM1874@zindigo.z-code.com> Organization: Z-Code Software Corp., Marin County, CA Reply-To: Bob Glickstein X-Face: =($SY|/2Odk(K$UOYYH88u8x@sP9c'l[^RZwSi<=~B9w.bD}Xueurgex5p1D:0')q.qr8iC%%|X5/3)Fyw-_/+i2V29(;~Rgf.@|7qE,<,cz_3V)c1OZ\yZj'f:QRM=9EqQ?\v&apsKCVfLuQ$46j!B,WJ"~/,A-+KjI;0j7ymyLC5j3gBm} X-Mailer: Z-Mail (2.1.0 10/27/92) To: Robert Andrew Ryan , Info-Andrew Subject: Re: Minor Parsec bug On Nov 24, 4:22pm, Robert Andrew Ryan wrote: > Thanks for the info, currently the code doesn't get built. > > Does anyone depend on parsec? (It parses original K&R C to an internal > parse tree representation.) Well, yyhide depends on parsec, and wasn't yyhide being used to build something else at one point? Was it libmssrv.a (which has the ELI parser and the AMS date parser in it)? (Yyhide is the parsec client which parses Yacc output and turns all the yy identifiers static, permitting multiple Yacc-generated modules to coexist in a binary.) -- Bob Glickstein Z-Code Software Corp. 4340 Redwood Highway Suite B-50 San Rafael, CA 94903 (415) 499-8649 \enddata{text822, 191700} \begindata{text822, 194342} Return-path: X-Andrew-Authenticated-as: 0;andrew.cmu.edu;Network-Mail Received: from po4.andrew.cmu.edu via trymail for info-andrew+@andrew.cmu.edu (->+dist+/afs/andrew.cmu.edu/usr0/ak99/dists/info-andrew-nostrip.dl) ID ; Wed, 25 Nov 1992 01:16:54 -0500 (EST) Received: from po4.andrew.cmu.edu via qmail ID ; Wed, 25 Nov 1992 01:16:02 -0500 (EST) If-Type-Unsupported: send Received: from po3.andrew.cmu.edu via qmail ID ; Wed, 25 Nov 1992 01:14:11 -0500 (EST) Received: from phantom.cislabs.pitt.edu by po3.andrew.cmu.edu (5.54/3.15) id for info-andrew; Wed, 25 Nov 92 01:13:59 EST Received: by phantom.cislabs.pitt.edu (4.1/1.34) id AA15207; Wed, 25 Nov 92 01:13:52 EST From: qralston@cislabs.pitt.edu (James Ralston Crawford) Message-Id: <9211250613.AA15207@phantom.cislabs.pitt.edu> Subject: questions concerning Andrew 5.1 To: info-andrew@andrew.cmu.edu Date: Wed, 25 Nov 1992 01:13:50 -0500 (EST) X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL11] Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 1226 Greetings. I just recently built and installed the Andrew distribution here, and have a few questions. 1. Why wasn't queuemail installed automatically? These are the important excerpts from my site.h: #define AMS_DELIVERY_ENV #define AFS_ENV #define AFS30_ENV #define AFS31_ENV #define RUN_AMDS_ENV ...yet queuemail was not installed during the make World; I had to do it myself. Is there something I missed? 2. What is necessary to make Messages recognize ispell 3.0? I know this has been discussed before, but unfortunately, I don't remember what the solution was, and it's not in the FAQ or any help documentation I can find. 3. Why does Messages appear to "mis-resolve" bboard names? Say I am sending email to this pitt.edu bboard: To: org.cis.proj.devtools If I "Check Recipients", it is resolved to: To: CIS Organizational BBoards If I "Check Recipients" again, I'm informed the name is invalid! Is there something I am missing? Thanks, and regards, James -- James Ralston Crawford \ Advanced Technology Lab qralston@cislabs.pitt.edu \ qralston+@pitt.edu \ qralston@pittvms.bitnet "You didn't tell him how long it would *really* take, did you?" - Scotty \enddata{text822, 194342} \begindata{text822, 196974} Return-path: X-Andrew-Authenticated-as: 1210;alw.nih.gov;Bob Dew Received: from spot.dcrt.nih.gov via trymail for info-andrew+@andrew.cmu.edu (->+dist+/afs/andrew.cmu.edu/usr0/ak99/dists/info-andrew-nostrip.dl) (->+dist+/afs/andrew.cmu.edu/usr0/ak99/dists/info-andrew-nostrip.dl@andrew.cmu.edu) ID ; Wed, 25 Nov 1992 11:15:44 -0500 (EST) Received: from kirin.dcrt.nih.gov via qmail ID ; Wed, 25 Nov 1992 11:15:36 -0500 (EST) If-Type-Unsupported: send Received: from spot.dcrt.nih.gov via qmail ID ; Wed, 25 Nov 1992 11:13:32 -0500 (EST) Received: from dude.dcrt.nih.gov via qmail ID ; Wed, 25 Nov 1992 11:11:55 -0500 (EST) Received: from dude.dcrt.nih.gov via qmail ID ; Wed, 25 Nov 1992 11:11:52 -0500 (EST) Received: from Messages.8.5.N.CUILIB.3.45.SNAP.NOT.LINKED.dude.dcrt.nih.gov.sun4c.411 via MS.5.6.dude.dcrt.nih.gov.sun4_41; Wed, 25 Nov 1992 11:11:51 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: Date: Wed, 25 Nov 1992 11:11:51 -0500 (EST) From: Bob Dew MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII To: Info-Andrew , Bob Dew , Craig_Everhart@transarc.com Subject: Re: AMDS race condition? In-Reply-To: <8f3JpGCSMUQ=Q5FGlp@transarc.com> References: <8f3JpGCSMUQ=Q5FGlp@transarc.com> Excerpts from mail: 20-Nov-92 Re: AMDS race condition? Craig_Everhart@transarc. (388+0) > I don't think that there's an AMDS race, but I've seen these duplicates > as well. There's an flock() held on one of the queued files--the GF.* > file, I think--for the duration of the delivery. Or at least there's > supposed to be. Having mail occasionally delivered twice seemed to be > not much of a problem, but more of a curiosity. Good luck if you intend > to pursue it further. > Craig After running a number of locking experiments, I cautiously conclude that its not only a possibility, but a relatively frequently observable occurrence that multiple queuemail daemons act simultaneously on the same queued message, resulting in multiple deliveries of the same mail message. On separate AFS clients, I ran a simple program that sleeps for a few seconds, then attempts to flock an AFS-stored file using exclusive-lock, no-block options. Its relatively easy to obtain multiple exclusive flocks on the same AFS file from different client processes acting independently. If two flock programs are initiated from different clients within about one second from each other, both client processes will often be granted an exclusive lock on the same file. (Granting a lock signals queuemail to process a message for delivery). I believe that the faster speed of the SPARCstation 2s have something to do with the marked increase we've seen in duplicate message deliveries. Perhaps the SPARCs are quicker than the RTs in racing against cache consistency checks. In any event, the increase in duplicate deliveries doesn't present a big problem for our delivery system. Doubling the sleep times for the respective queuemail daemons on one postoffice, and tripling them on the other, about makes our system work like it used to. -Bob \enddata{text822, 196974} \begindata{text822, 200643} X-Andrew-Authenticated-As: 469;andrew.cmu.edu;Craig F. Everhart Return-path: X-Andrew-Authenticated-as: 1312;transarc.com;Craig Everhart Received: from mobius via trymail for info-andrew+@andrew.cmu.edu (->+dist+/afs/andrew.cmu.edu/usr0/ak99/dists/info-andrew-nostrip.dl) (->+dist+/afs/andrew.cmu.edu/usr0/ak99/dists/info-andrew-nostrip.dl@andrew.cmu.edu) ID ; Wed, 25 Nov 1992 12:20:41 -0500 (EST) If-Type-Unsupported: send Received: from mobius via qmail ID ; Wed, 25 Nov 1992 12:19:25 -0500 (EST) Received: from Messages.7.14.N.CUILIB.3.45.SNAP.NOT.LINKED.mobius.sun4.40 via MS.5.6.mobius.sun4_40; Wed, 25 Nov 1992 12:19:24 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: Date: Wed, 25 Nov 1992 12:19:24 -0500 (EST) From: Craig_Everhart@transarc.com X-Andrew-Message-Size: 587+0 Content-Type: X-BE2; 12 To: Info-Andrew , Bob Dew Subject: Re: AMDS race condition? In-Reply-To: References: <8f3JpGCSMUQ=Q5FGlp@transarc.com>, \begindata{text,2667160} \textdsversion{12} \template{messages} Bob, Thanks for the detective work. I forwarded your message to the AFS product support folks, and I hope you'll be hearing from them to find out how you produced the problem. That said, I indeed expected that it wasn't an AMDS race; rather, your evidence suggests that it's an AFS locking bug. I've seen the duplication before, but with only one PO machine here, we don't see much of it. So far, I haven't worried much about it for the AMDS application. But if you've reproduced the problem without AMDS involvement, then it suggests a more serious AFS glitch. Thanks, Craig \enddata{text,2667160} \enddata{text822, 200643} \begindata{text822, 202693} X-Andrew-Authenticated-As: 469;andrew.cmu.edu;Craig F. Everhart Return-path: X-Andrew-Authenticated-as: 1312;transarc.com;Craig Everhart Received: from mobius via trymail for info-andrew+@andrew.cmu.edu (->+dist+/afs/andrew.cmu.edu/usr0/ak99/dists/info-andrew-nostrip.dl) ID ; Wed, 25 Nov 1992 12:45:46 -0500 (EST) Received: from mobius via qmail ID ; Wed, 25 Nov 1992 12:45:16 -0500 (EST) Received: from Messages.7.14.N.CUILIB.3.45.SNAP.NOT.LINKED.mobius.sun4.40 via MS.5.6.mobius.sun4_40; Wed, 25 Nov 1992 12:45:13 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <8f4vidSSMUQ=QMWY1Q@transarc.com> Date: Wed, 25 Nov 1992 12:45:13 -0500 (EST) From: Craig_Everhart@transarc.com X-Andrew-Message-Size: 2249+0 Content-Type: X-BE2; 12 If-Type-Unsupported: send To: Info-Andrew , qralston@cislabs.pitt.edu (James Ralston Crawford) Subject: Re: questions concerning Andrew 5.1 In-Reply-To: <9211250613.AA15207@phantom.cislabs.pitt.edu> References: <9211250613.AA15207@phantom.cislabs.pitt.edu> \begindata{text,2667160} \textdsversion{12} \template{messages} \excerptedcaption{Excerpts from internet.other.info-andrew: 25-Nov-92 questions concerning Andrew.. James R. Crawford@cislab (1226*)} \quotation{1. Why wasn't queuemail installed automatically? } \quotation{ These are the important excerpts from my site.h: } \quotation{#define AMS_DELIVERY_ENV }\quotation{#define AFS_ENV }\quotation{#define AFS30_ENV }\quotation{#define AFS31_ENV }\quotation{#define RUN_AMDS_ENV } \quotation{ ...yet queuemail was not installed during the make World; I }\quotation{had to do it myself. Is there something I missed? } I think it's because queuemail wants to be installed setuid-daemon, and the Andrew installation mechanism assumes that it can't do that. (So the installation is omitted, silently, sigh.) \quotation{3. Why does Messages appear to "mis-resolve" bboard names? } \quotation{ Say I am sending email to this pitt.edu bboard: } \quotation{To: org.cis.proj.devtools } \quotation{ If I "Check Recipients", it is resolved to: } \quotation{To: CIS Organizational BBoards } \quotation{ If I "Check Recipients" again, I'm informed the name is }\quotation{invalid! Is there something I am missing? } Is this a public bboard at pitt.edu, or is this on your own *.mspath? I'm looking at /afs/pitt.edu/service/configuration/AMS-Server to try to find the bboard root in question. The infamous code in \{andrew\}/ams/libs/ms/mswp.c in this case is trying to verify the annotation beyond the ``+'' in ``cisbb+''. It's doing this by looking at the home dir for ``cisbb+@pitt.edu'' and checking whether that pathname (with ``/.MESSAGES'' appended) is the same as any of the bboard roots listed in mspath. I can't find ~cisbb/.MESSAGES (/afs/pitt.edu/usr0/cisbb/.MESSAGES) in the bboard roots in /afs/pitt.edu/service/configuration/AMS-Server, but maybe that file isn't up to date, or maybe you have ~cisbb/.MESSAGES in your own mspath. Once mswp.c finds such a match, it probably translates dots to slashes in the name suffix, then checks whether there's a bboard under that .MESSAGES directory with that name. In this case, it would be looking for /afs/pitt.edu/usr0/cisbb/.MESSAGES/proj/devtools/.MS_MsgDir. If ~cisbb/.MESSAGES is in your mspath, is there such a directory? Yes, this extra validation attempt probably doesn't match all configurations, but it can be real useful sometimes. Do you really need ~cisbb/.MESSAGES on your mspath, or is it a historical relic? Craig \enddata{text,2667160} \enddata{text822, 202693} \begindata{text822, 206552} Return-path: X-Andrew-Authenticated-as: 7274;pitt.edu;Jeffrey J. Carpenter Received: from pitt.edu via trymail ID ; Wed, 25 Nov 1992 14:28:16 -0500 (EST) Received: from sea-green.cis.pitt.edu via qmail ID ; Wed, 25 Nov 1992 14:24:14 -0500 (EST) Received: from sea-green.cis.pitt.edu via qmail ID ; Wed, 25 Nov 1992 14:18:58 -0500 (EST) Received: from Messages.7.15.N.CUILIB.3.45.SNAP.NOT.LINKED.sea.green.cis.pitt.edu.pmax.3 via MS.5.6.sea-green.cis.pitt.edu.pmax_3; Wed, 25 Nov 1992 14:18:58 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: Date: Wed, 25 Nov 1992 14:18:58 -0500 (EST) From: "Jeffrey J. Carpenter" To: Info-Andrew , qralston@cislabs.pitt.edu (James Ralston Crawford), Craig_Everhart@transarc.com Subject: Re: questions concerning Andrew 5.1 In-Reply-To: <8f4vidSSMUQ=QMWY1Q@transarc.com> References: <9211250613.AA15207@phantom.cislabs.pitt.edu> <8f4vidSSMUQ=QMWY1Q@transarc.com> Excerpts from mail: 25-Nov-92 Re: questions concerning An.. Craig_Everhart@transarc. (2249+0) > Yes, this extra validation attempt probably doesn't match all > configurations, but it can be real useful sometimes. Do you really need > ~cisbb/.MESSAGES on your mspath, or is it a historical relic? It is a historical relic and should not be in the mspath. The cisbb bboards are available through /afs/pitt.edu/usr0/bb/... jeff \enddata{text822, 206552} \begindata{text822, 208286} Return-path: X-Andrew-Authenticated-as: 0;andrew.cmu.edu;Network-Mail Received: from andrew.cmu.edu via trymail for info-andrew+@andrew.cmu.edu (->+dist+/afs/andrew.cmu.edu/usr0/ak99/dists/info-andrew-nostrip.dl) ID ; Wed, 25 Nov 1992 16:31:11 -0500 (EST) Received: from andrew.cmu.edu via qmail ID ; Wed, 25 Nov 1992 16:29:12 -0500 (EST) If-Type-Unsupported: send Received: from po3.andrew.cmu.edu via qmail ID ; Wed, 25 Nov 1992 16:25:59 -0500 (EST) Received: from phantom.cislabs.pitt.edu by po3.andrew.cmu.edu (5.54/3.15) id for info-andrew+; Wed, 25 Nov 92 16:25:46 EST Received: by phantom.cislabs.pitt.edu (4.1/1.34) id AA21941; Wed, 25 Nov 92 16:25:38 EST From: qralston@cislabs.pitt.edu (James Ralston Crawford) Message-Id: <9211252125.AA21941@phantom.cislabs.pitt.edu> Subject: Re: questions concerning Andrew 5.1 To: info-andrew+@andrew.cmu.edu (Info-Andrew), Craig_Everhart@transarc.com, gk5g+@andrew.cmu.edu (Gary Keim), jjc+@pitt.edu (Jeffrey J. Carpenter) Date: Wed, 25 Nov 1992 16:25:37 -0500 (EST) Cc: rm55+@pitt.edu (Mingo), infidel+@pitt.edu (Infidel) In-Reply-To: <8f4vidSSMUQ=QMWY1Q@transarc.com> from "Craig_Everhart@transarc.com" at Nov 25, 92 12:45:13 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL11] Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 1378 Craig_Everhart@transarc.com writes: > Excerpts from internet.other.info-andrew: 25-Nov-92 questions concerning > Andrew.. James R. Crawford@cislab (1226*) > > > 1. Why wasn't queuemail installed automatically? > > I think it's because queuemail wants to be installed setuid-daemon, > and the Andrew installation mechanism assumes that it can't do that. > (So the installation is omitted, silently, sigh.) Ok, so that's all... I thought I had misconfigured something. This would probably be a good candidate to shove into either FAQ[.ez] and/or README[.ez]... Is there anything else that is silently not installed? > > 3. Why does Messages appear to "mis-resolve" bboard names? > > [...] > > Yes, this extra validation attempt probably doesn't match all > configurations, but it can be real useful sometimes. Do you really need > ~cisbb/.MESSAGES on your mspath, or is it a historical relic? As Jeff pointed out, no, I don't; after I removed it, Recipient checking worked fine. Thanks. In a separate message, Gary Keim writes: > Excerpts from misc: 25-Nov-92 questions concerning Andrew.. James R. > Crawford@cislab (1226*) > > > 2. What is necessary to make Messages recognize ispell 3.0? > > There is an informal patch to andrew/atk/extensions/spell.c on > emsworth in ./pub/ispell3-patches.tar.Z. Again, thanks for the information. Regards, James \enddata{text822, 208286} \begindata{text822, 211355} Return-path: X-Andrew-Authenticated-as: 0;andrew.cmu.edu;Network-Mail Received: from po4.andrew.cmu.edu via trymail for info-andrew+@andrew.cmu.edu (->+dist+/afs/andrew.cmu.edu/usr0/ak99/dists/info-andrew-nostrip.dl) ID ; Fri, 27 Nov 1992 09:32:47 -0500 (EST) Received: from po3.andrew.cmu.edu via qmail ID ; Fri, 27 Nov 1992 09:28:20 -0500 (EST) Received: from chx400.switch.ch by po3.andrew.cmu.edu (5.54/3.15) id for info-andrew; Fri, 27 Nov 92 09:28:12 EST X400-Received: by mta chx400.switch.ch in /PRMD=switch/ADMD=arcom/C=CH/; Relayed; Fri, 27 Nov 1992 15:27:47 +0100 X400-Received: by /PRMD=switch/ADMD=arcom/C=ch/; Relayed; Fri, 27 Nov 1992 15:27:26 +0100 X400-Received: by /PRMD=switch/ADMD=arcom/C=ch/; Relayed; Fri, 27 Nov 1992 15:27:17 +0100 Date: Fri, 27 Nov 1992 15:27:17 +0100 X400-Originator: bauer@komsys.tik.ethz.ch X400-Recipients: info-andrew@andrew.cmu.edu X400-Mts-Identifier: [/PRMD=switch/ADMD=arcom/C=ch/;921127152717] X400-Content-Type: P2-1984 (2) Content-Identifier: 51 From: Daniel Bauer Message-Id: <51*/S=bauer/OU=komsys/OU=tik/O=ethz/PRMD=SWITCH/ADMD=ARCOM/C=CH/@MHS> To: info-andrew@andrew.cmu.edu Subject: inset and application Hi, I am programming an inset and like to do some cleanup when the user quits the application. The inset is loaded by an application which is derived from ez. I have no problem in creating my own "Quit" and "Delete Window" menu entries, but I want to reuse the old "Delete Window"-entry. If a user types CTRL X-2, a second window appears and that window should be destroyed when the user selects "Delete Window". But if the last window is destroyed, my inset should do a "cleanup" (and only then). So my question is: How can I modify (not replace) a menu-entry ? My application is derived from ez. When I start the application, ez loads the inset because it is specified in the command-line. How can I access inset-functions within the application-code ? Thank you. --------------------------- D. Bauer. E-Mail: bauer@komsys.tik.ethz.ch \enddata{text822, 211355} \begindata{text822, 213700} Return-path: X-Andrew-Authenticated-as: 0;andrew.cmu.edu;Network-Mail Received: from po4.andrew.cmu.edu via trymail for info-andrew+@andrew.cmu.edu (->+dist+/afs/andrew.cmu.edu/usr0/ak99/dists/info-andrew-nostrip.dl) ID ; Mon, 30 Nov 1992 04:55:03 -0500 (EST) Received: from po5.andrew.cmu.edu via qmail ID ; Mon, 30 Nov 1992 04:52:38 -0500 (EST) Received: from ucbvax.Berkeley.EDU by po5.andrew.cmu.edu (5.54/3.15) id for info-andrew; Mon, 30 Nov 92 04:52:26 EST Received: by ucbvax.Berkeley.EDU (5.63/1.43) id AA16548; Sat, 28 Nov 92 15:16:38 -0800 Path: ucbvax!agate!spool.mu.edu!uwm.edu!caen!sol.ctr.columbia.edu!ira.uka.de!chx400!sicsun!disuns2!disuns2.epfl.ch!simon From: simon@lia.di.epfl.ch (Simon Leinen) Newsgroups: comp.soft-sys.andrew Subject: Re: Building Andrew on a Silicon Graphics Message-Id: Date: 9 Nov 92 19:13:05 GMT References: <1992Nov9.131749.961@newton.bioch.ox.ac.uk> Sender: news@disuns2.epfl.ch Organization: DI-LIA -- Ecole Polytechnique Federale de Lausanne Lines: 13 Nntp-Posting-Host: liasg2.epfl.ch In-Reply-To: mikes@bioch.ox.ac.uk's message of 9 Nov 92 13:17:49 GMT X-Md4-Signature: 3df70983c742c38eba7543c97e7bdd1a Apparently-To: info-andrew@andrew.cmu.edu In article <1992Nov9.131749.961@newton.bioch.ox.ac.uk> mikes@bioch.ox.ac.uk (Mike Smith) writes: cc -G 0 -cckr -c -O -I. -I/usr/andrew/include/atk -I/usr/andrew/include -I/usr/include -DSYSV -D_BSD_SIGNALS doload.c cpp: error /usr/include/syms.h:113: Can't find include file cmplrs/stsupport.h This means that you should install the IRIX subsystem "dev.complrs_hdr.internal" (Base Compiler Internal Headers). I think you also need this if you want to compile GNU CC. Hope this helps, -- Simon. \enddata{text822, 213700} \begindata{text822, 215706} Return-path: X-Andrew-Authenticated-as: 0;andrew.cmu.edu;Network-Mail Received: from po5.andrew.cmu.edu via trymail for info-andrew+@andrew.cmu.edu (->+dist+/afs/andrew.cmu.edu/usr0/ak99/dists/info-andrew-nostrip.dl) ID ; Mon, 30 Nov 1992 05:13:27 -0500 (EST) Received: from po5.andrew.cmu.edu via qmail ID ; Mon, 30 Nov 1992 05:12:28 -0500 (EST) Received: from ucbvax.Berkeley.EDU by po5.andrew.cmu.edu (5.54/3.15) id for info-andrew; Mon, 30 Nov 92 05:12:19 EST Received: by ucbvax.Berkeley.EDU (5.63/1.43) id AA19012; Sat, 28 Nov 92 17:19:14 -0800 Path: ucbvax!agate!usenet.ins.cwru.edu!magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!uwm.edu!spool.mu.edu!uunet!pipex!warwick!uknet!comlab.ox.ac.uk!mikes From: mikes@bioch.ox.ac.uk (Mike Smith) Newsgroups: comp.soft-sys.andrew Subject: Building Andrew on a Silicon Graphics Message-Id: <1992Nov9.131749.961@newton.bioch.ox.ac.uk> Date: 9 Nov 92 13:17:49 GMT Organization: Department of Biochemistry, University of Oxford Lines: 17 Originator: mikes@newton.bioch Apparently-To: info-andrew@andrew.cmu.edu I would like some help with building the andrew software on my Silicon Graphics which is running 4.0.5. Everything is (or should be) in the standard places. This is as far as I get ... cc -G 0 -cckr -c -O -I. -I/usr/andrew/include/atk -I/usr/andrew/include -I/usr/include -DSYSV -D_BSD_SIGNALS doload.c cpp: error /usr/include/syms.h:113: Can't find include file cmplrs/stsupport.h I have to admit that I haven't altered the files config/site.h and config/site.mcr, but I can't work out what (if anything) I need to do here. Any help anyone? Many Thanks Mike Smith \enddata{text822, 215706} \begindata{text822, 217619} Return-path: X-Andrew-Authenticated-as: 0;andrew.cmu.edu;Network-Mail Received: from po2.andrew.cmu.edu via trymail for info-andrew+@andrew.cmu.edu (->+dist+/afs/andrew.cmu.edu/usr0/ak99/dists/info-andrew-nostrip.dl) ID ; Wed, 2 Dec 1992 10:35:05 -0500 (EST) Received: from po5.andrew.cmu.edu via qmail ID ; Wed, 2 Dec 1992 10:31:37 -0500 (EST) Received: from ucbvax.Berkeley.EDU by po5.andrew.cmu.edu (5.54/3.15) id for info-andrew; Wed, 2 Dec 92 10:31:17 EST Received: by ucbvax.Berkeley.EDU (5.63/1.43) id AA11657; Wed, 2 Dec 92 07:23:16 -0800 Received: from USENET by ucbvax.Berkeley.EDU with netnews for info-andrew@andrew.cmu.edu (info-andrew@andrew.cmu.edu) (contact usenet@ucbvax.Berkeley.EDU if you have questions) Date: 20 Nov 92 20:55:16 GMT From: cis.ohio-state.edu!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!cs.utexas.edu!torn!nott!cunews!csi.uottawa.ca!news@ucbvax.Berkeley.EDU (Isabelle Tourneux) Organization: MCRLab - University of Ottawa Subject: communication between Adew controllers Message-Id: <1992Nov20.205516.1211@csi.uottawa.ca> Sender: info-andrew-request@andrew.cmu.edu To: info-andrew@andrew.cmu.edu First, thank you very much for all the detailed answers you have given me concerning message queues. This has however led me to other questions : I have several adew "view+controller" in the same machine, which are spawned successively with forks and execs. I would like to have them communicate with each other. So I have looked at all the possible means of communication between these controllers. I am using System V. - FIFO and message queues work but they are not directly usable to read a message that can come any time. I would have to be waiting for it or to have an infinite loop in the code of the adew controller, which is not possible. I know it is possible to modify xim.c and to add a message queue to the select, , but I do not wish to do such low-level modifications on xim.c. - interruptions would be a nice solution, but I have not managed to get the pid of the controller without clicking somewhere on the view. A getpid() in controller_go gives the pid of runadew I guess. Moreover, runadew puts the group id of the controller equal to the pid of this controller, so I cannot get the group id of the controller without clicking on the view, as for the pid. Is it possible to change the code of runadew to prevent it from initializing the group id of the controller ? Do you think interruptions would work as I am working under System V and Xwindows ? - I know sockets would be a solution, but I would prefer not to use them for internal communication between processes runing on the same machine : I am afraid I will not be able to send a huge file through a socket without cutting it into smaller parts, and I would like to avoid that. Do you think Unix Domain Sockets could allow me to send huge file without cutting them ? - as all my controllers have got different names, I have thought about memorizing the pointers on each controller in a memory shared by all the processes : struct controlleri * ptri ( i = 1, 2...), and call functions of a controller from another controller, using this pointers : controller1_thisFunction(ptr1) in the code of the 2nd controller for instance. The 1st controller is running, but the function is not called successfully, and there is a segmentation fault. Before, I had never had problems with memorizing pointers on an ATK view or dataobject in another ATK view or dataobject, and calling functions with these pointers. Is there something specific to adew which prevents from doing that ? I am trying at any rate to establish a communication between Adew controllers, but it is hard because adew and runadew were not written for that kind of application, but were supposed to be used only for prototyping. Anyway I really want to find a way of establishing these connections, even if the solution is not the most elegant. Thanks for your help. isabelle Tourneux Multimadia Lab of the University of Ottawa. isabelle@shamin.genie.uottawa.ca \enddata{text822, 217619} \begindata{text822, 221942} Return-path: X-Andrew-Authenticated-as: 0;andrew.cmu.edu;Network-Mail Received: from po2.andrew.cmu.edu via trymail for info-andrew+@andrew.cmu.edu (->+dist+/afs/andrew.cmu.edu/usr0/ak99/dists/info-andrew-nostrip.dl) ID ; Wed, 2 Dec 1992 10:35:05 -0500 (EST) Received: from po5.andrew.cmu.edu via qmail ID ; Wed, 2 Dec 1992 10:31:37 -0500 (EST) Received: from ucbvax.Berkeley.EDU by po5.andrew.cmu.edu (5.54/3.15) id for info-andrew; Wed, 2 Dec 92 10:31:17 EST Received: by ucbvax.Berkeley.EDU (5.63/1.43) id AA11657; Wed, 2 Dec 92 07:23:16 -0800 Received: from USENET by ucbvax.Berkeley.EDU with netnews for info-andrew@andrew.cmu.edu (info-andrew@andrew.cmu.edu) (contact usenet@ucbvax.Berkeley.EDU if you have questions) Date: 20 Nov 92 20:55:16 GMT From: cis.ohio-state.edu!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!cs.utexas.edu!torn!nott!cunews!csi.uottawa.ca!news@ucbvax.Berkeley.EDU (Isabelle Tourneux) Organization: MCRLab - University of Ottawa Subject: communication between Adew controllers Message-Id: <1992Nov20.205516.1211@csi.uottawa.ca> Sender: info-andrew-request@andrew.cmu.edu To: info-andrew@andrew.cmu.edu First, thank you very much for all the detailed answers you have given me concerning message queues. This has however led me to other questions : I have several adew "view+controller" in the same machine, which are spawned successively with forks and execs. I would like to have them communicate with each other. So I have looked at all the possible means of communication between these controllers. I am using System V. - FIFO and message queues work but they are not directly usable to read a message that can come any time. I would have to be waiting for it or to have an infinite loop in the code of the adew controller, which is not possible. I know it is possible to modify xim.c and to add a message queue to the select, , but I do not wish to do such low-level modifications on xim.c. - interruptions would be a nice solution, but I have not managed to get the pid of the controller without clicking somewhere on the view. A getpid() in controller_go gives the pid of runadew I guess. Moreover, runadew puts the group id of the controller equal to the pid of this controller, so I cannot get the group id of the controller without clicking on the view, as for the pid. Is it possible to change the code of runadew to prevent it from initializing the group id of the controller ? Do you think interruptions would work as I am working under System V and Xwindows ? - I know sockets would be a solution, but I would prefer not to use them for internal communication between processes runing on the same machine : I am afraid I will not be able to send a huge file through a socket without cutting it into smaller parts, and I would like to avoid that. Do you think Unix Domain Sockets could allow me to send huge file without cutting them ? - as all my controllers have got different names, I have thought about memorizing the pointers on each controller in a memory shared by all the processes : struct controlleri * ptri ( i = 1, 2...), and call functions of a controller from another controller, using this pointers : controller1_thisFunction(ptr1) in the code of the 2nd controller for instance. The 1st controller is running, but the function is not called successfully, and there is a segmentation fault. Before, I had never had problems with memorizing pointers on an ATK view or dataobject in another ATK view or dataobject, and calling functions with these pointers. Is there something specific to adew which prevents from doing that ? I am trying at any rate to establish a communication between Adew controllers, but it is hard because adew and runadew were not written for that kind of application, but were supposed to be used only for prototyping. Anyway I really want to find a way of establishing these connections, even if the solution is not the most elegant. Thanks for your help. isabelle Tourneux Multimadia Lab of the University of Ottawa. isabelle@shamin.genie.uottawa.ca \enddata{text822, 221942}