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From: deb5@ellis.uchicago.edu (Daniel von Brighoff)
Subject: Re: Bable/Asturian [was:Re: English importation of words
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Date: Thu, 4 Apr 1996 22:25:57 GMT
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In article <4jugan$ric@neptunus.pi.net>,
Miguel Carrasquer Vidal <mcv@pi.net> wrote:
>deb5@harper.uchicago.edu (Daniel von Brighoff) wrote:

>>From what I've seen (I've yet to set my eyes on the grammar of standardised
>>Asturiano which our library supposedly owns), Bable looks more like Arago-
>>nese than Galician.  Both of these are languages of former Spanish kingdoms
>>that, after a long period of attrition, have lapsed to the status of dia-
>>lects of Castillian.
>
>Indeed.  I know very little about (Asturian) Bable, but I have seen
>some texts in (Aragonese) Fabla.  In some respects, Aragonese is
>closer to Galaico-Portuguese than it is to Castilian, and it's
>probably even closer to Bable.  In other respects, Fabla is
>reminiscent of (West-)Catalan.  Finally, there is also an undeniable
>Castilian influence. 
>
>The Romance languages of Northern Spain once must have formed a
>continuum (Galician-Bable-Castilian-Fabla-West Catalan-East Catalan),
>with Castilian in many respects the most aberrant member (due largely
>to an earlier period of Basque-Latin bilingualism in Castille).
>
>Galician (in the guise of Portuguese), Castilian and Catalan went on
>to spread southwards, Bable and Fabla remained confined to the
>mountains of Asturias and Upper Aragon (the languages of Leon and
>Lower Aragon can be safely classified as dialects of Castilian, with
>only small traces of an original Bable/Fabla substrate).  

I don't think this is strictly accurate, due to what I've read about
Murcian.  Although it is now considered a transitional dialect between
Andalucian and Western Catalan, Murcian seems to have fewer affinities
to the latter than it does to Aragonese.  This implies that Aragonese
may once have been spoken there.

>As to the present status of Bable and Fabla (dialects or languages?),
>it's hard to decide.  If you're a believer in trees, they are
>definitely separate languages.  If you're more into waves, then it's
>clear that Bable, Fabla and even Galician have been rather inundated
>by Castilian isoglosses.  Take your pick.

As definitions of languages vs. dialects tend to be more political
than anything else, I'd prefer to call them "dialects" since, as I
told "Coby", they no longer have recognised, standardised "high" 
varieties (the recent creations of "Asturianu" notwithstanding) and
continue to have their distinctive features lose ground to Castilian
forms.
-- 
	 Daniel "Da" von Brighoff    /\          Dilettanten
	(deb5@midway.uchicago.edu)  /__\         erhebt Euch
				   /____\      gegen die Kunst!
