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From: hbiesel@uvsc.edu (Visitor)
Subject: Re: John Mc Carthy's request re: Penrose (mechanisms for consciousness)
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Date: Fri, 4 Nov 1994 20:42:10 GMT
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In article <397hb5$7hp@ixnews1.ix.netcom.com>, sarfatti@ix.netcom.com (Jack Sarfatti) says:

>Look, the single electron at the alpha/beta tubulin interface in each 
>dimer protein on the wall of the microtubule is clearly a quantum 
>system. It is a 2-state quantum system (see Feynman Lectures Vol III)- 
>formally it is like a spin 1/2 (even though we are talking about the two 
>possible spatial positions rather than orientation of the magnetic 
>moment in a field). The two "quantum" positions of the electron 
>in a hydrophobic pocket correspond to two different "classical" 
>conformations of the dimer which have profound biological effects on the 
>release of synaptic vesicles etc. So here we are right at the 
>"quantum"-"classical" boundary where Penrose thinks his new "OR" physics 
>comes into play. There's all sorts of other stuff happening here. Like 
>Frohlich electric-dipole membrane oscillations and laser self-focussing 
>inside the ordered ion-free water inside the microtubules all of which 
>couple to the electrons in some complex way that I do not yet understand 
>very clearly. This is clearly an "Eccle's gate" sort of situation. The 
>two-states of the electron are a quantum switch. The electron can be in 
>a coherent superposition of its two possible positions. These can get 
>entangled with the two positions of the dimer sort of like Schrodinger's 
>Cat. We seem to have a quantum computer here - the Frohlich oscillations 
>and the laser filaments bringing information into and out of the quantum 
>computer perhaps. In any case the whole system is immensely interesting 
>and must be studied in detail with super-computer simulations. It 
>clearly looks like the nitty gritty where consciousness is generated. 
>The main experimental fact is when the anaesthetic molecules physically 
>move into the hydrophobic regions in the alpha/beta tubulin boundary 
>region that they jam the electrons - prevent their oscillations - 
>destroy the coherent superpositions and lo and behold we lose 
>consciousness. It's as if we jammed the transistor switches in our 
>computer and the computer stops. We jam the electron quantum switches 
>and our consciousness stops! That's sure suggestive to me! I can see 
>what Hameroff is so excited about and why Penrose might have jumped for 
>joy exclaiming "The truth is found, the truth is found" (Princess Ida) 
>when he found out. :-)

How much of the sketched interaction between anaesthetic molecules
and the tubulins is based on solid, replicated biochemistry, and how much
is still conjectural? Is it the case that every anaesthetic acts by the suggested
mechanism?

Yours,
         H.B.
