Newsgroups: sci.lang
Path: cantaloupe.srv.cs.cmu.edu!rochester!rutgers!news.sgi.com!www.nntp.primenet.com!nntp.primenet.com!netcom.com!elna
From: elna@netcom.com (Esperanto League N America)
Subject: Fault &c.-  Esperanto
Message-ID: <elnaDxIBoq.9zy@netcom.com>
Organization: Esperanto League for North America, Inc.
References: <19960902060147.baaa003K0@babyblue.cs.yale.edu> <Pine.SUN.3.94.960904082145.5448E-100000@access5.digex.net> <elnaDxH6rv.J3v@netcom.com> <Pine.SUN.3.94.960909194727.18099A-100000@access4.digex.net>
Date: Tue, 10 Sep 1996 08:02:50 GMT
Lines: 64
Sender: elna@netcom7.netcom.com

Paul O Bartlett <pobart@access.digex.net> writes in a recent posting (reference <Pine.SUN.3.94.960909194727.18099A-100000@access4.digex.net>):
>On Mon, 9 Sep 1996, Esperanto League N America wrote:
>
>> Paul O Bartlett [...] writes in a recent posting [...]:
>> >    One of the problems with _any_ conlang IAL, including Esperanto, 
>> >is distribution of materials.  [...]
>> This is undeniably true, but it is not the fault of the language itself!
>> BTW is it easier to find works in any other small language- e.g. Basque 
>> or Estonian?
>
>    Where did you get the idea (if that's what you really mean) that I
                                 ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
No, not at all.... I suppose there ought to be some sort of smiley-like
emoticon to indicate that I am *not* making a "loaded" statement....  

>was claiming a fault in the language itself in this remark???  I am not
>saying that it is the "fault" of Basque or Estonian that they are not
>well represented in American bookstores, either. 

Of course not; I was just making a similar statement parenthetically-- it
was a casual comment not intended to imply that you thought anything
judgemental towards Esperanto, Klingon, Basque, etc... It was a 
developemnt of your theme; not its perversion to some form of insult
nor accusation.  The difficulty of obtaining materials in or about *any*
small language is *not* a reflection of its value, but rather a condemnation
of our parochial bookstores!!   

>       My only point was
>that difficulty in acquiring materials in Esperanto -- or Basque or
>Estonian! -- hinders acquisition and use of the language itself.  That
>has nothing to do with any intrinsic qualities (or lack thereof) in the
>language itself.  (You will also note that I was referring to conlangs
>in general, not just Esperanto.)
>
Of course.

>    I wonder why some -- not all -- Esperantists are so touchy?  Some
>of them seem to get their backs up over the littlest things, apparently
>imagining slights against their precious language when there was no
>slight.
>
Here I must again raise the issue of pre-judgement influencing the way you
read some postings. I was *not* being "touchy" nor "getting my back up" nor
even "imagining slights" against anything.   How much emotion have you read 
into the simple word "fault"?  What in your history of discussions with
Esperantists has influenced this tendency to extrapolate "touchiness" or
"fuzzy-headedness" [BTW I still don't quite understand this term!]  To be
sure, many Esperantists fall into the same pattern of extrapolating or
even imagining slights, condescensions, dismissals and the like based on a
history of this kind of reaction-- it is a natural and common 
sociolinguistic phenomenon.  If you start out thinking or fearing that 
your interlocutor has certain characteristics, you are likely to find them!

Now, of course this entire conversation could be a hall of mirrors: perhaps
you were not claiming that *my* response demonstrated this "touchiness"
nor that I was "getting my back up" while "imagining slights".  So perhaps
I should refrain from suggesting that you were suggesting that I had 
interpreted your interpretation in any way impolitic.  :-)

-- 
Miko SLOPER                   elna@netcom.com         USA  (510) 653 0998
Direktoro de la          ftp.netcom.com:/pub/el/elna   fax (510) 653 1468 
Centra Oficejo de la     Learn Esperanto! Free lessons: e-mail/snail-mail
Esperanto-Ligo de N.A.      Write to above address or call 1-800-828 5944
