Newsgroups: comp.lang.smalltalk
Path: cantaloupe.srv.cs.cmu.edu!das-news2.harvard.edu!news2.near.net!howland.reston.ans.net!news.sprintlink.net!news.tyrell.net!news
From: vchild@tyrell.net
Subject: Re: VisualAge vs. ST/V
X-Nntp-Posting-Host: ttyt4.tyrell.net
Message-ID: <D44nsn.1wv@tyrell.net>
Sender: news@tyrell.net (*)
Reply-To: vchild@tyrell.net
Organization: Tyrell Corporation - 800-TYRELL-1 - POP's in 504/816/913/316
X-Newsreader: IBM NewsReader/2 v1.09
References: <3ht3bd$o0e$1@mhadf.production.compuserve.com>
Date: Fri, 17 Feb 1995 04:43:34 GMT
Lines: 59

In <3ht3bd$o0e$1@mhadf.production.compuserve.com>, RLC <74761.164@CompuServe.COM> writes:
>I'd appreciate any first hand knowledge from anyone familiar with 
>the IBM and the Digitalk Smalltalk products. 

Ok.

> I have heard that, 
>in comparison with DT, IBM has some performance issues to deal 
>with both in the runtime and development environments.  

True, but the performance difference(s) is (are) really pretty marginal.

>Running multiple ST images on one machine (or multiple apps in 
>one image)?

We do that with regularity at our shop. Do you want hardware specs? Image sizes
etc? (OS/2 2.11 50mhz 486sx 24mb RAM - which might seem large to Windoze 
users but these machines do quite a bit - we run multiple LU 6.2 sessions, 3 3270
sesssions, a document imaging application and 2 seperate ST Images..and 
performance is very good)(If I had to guess both ST apps are of moderate
complexity (100-ish classes, 9-12 panels/windows each) about 2mb apeice).

>Integration with DBMS, other 3rd party tools?

Here is where VA shines. If you happen to be operating in an IBM shop, the external
interfaces available in VA make a dramatic impact. I use the APPC, HLAPPI, DB2/2
and CICS-OS/2 Support in our Aps. The integration of these tools into the product
are very good and work extremely well. At the time, ST/V didn't offer the breadth
of interfaces that VA does. ParcPlace just doesn't have things like APPC/CICS-OS/2
support. THe integration of the ST and "drawing" environments puts ST/V & Parts
to shame.

>Stability of the environment?

Much, much better in ver 2.0 - though not perfect. (In my experience, it is quite a
bit better than ST/V-Parts which had meltdowns almost hourly).

>Application delivery mechinisms/options/etc?

The ENVY environment really helps here. I never used the TEAM option of ST/V
so I can't comment but VA & Envy is WONDERFUL from a change control 
perspective. I can be more specific if you want. THe packaging is very good, IBM
did a great job in ver 2.0, the push-button packager works just fine in 99% of the
case but if you want more control you can weed out the included classes 
yourself (not for the faint of heart).

>Gosh I've asked for alot, but perhaps there are some shortcomings 
>in either environment that might push me to into purchasing one 
>over the other -- for enterprise-wide (read: bigtime folks) 
>development.

The external interfaces in an Enterprise (IBM) environment and the excellent 
TEAM programming support is what won us over.

#########################################################
### Bart K. Childers  ###  Insert humorous .SIG here  ###
### vchild@tyrell.net ###                             ###
#########################################################

