Newsgroups: comp.lang.dylan
Path: cantaloupe.srv.cs.cmu.edu!rochester!udel!news.mathworks.com!newsfeed.internetmci.com!in2.uu.net!netnews.jhuapl.edu!aplcenmp!hall
From: hall@aplcenmp.apl.jhu.edu (Marty Hall)
Subject: Re: Java v. Dylan (was Re: Apple Dylan discussions at WWDC)
Message-ID: <Ds4By9.FDL@aplcenmp.apl.jhu.edu>
Organization: JHU/APL Research Center, Hopkins P/T CS Faculty
References: <2915795087@hoult.actrix.gen.nz> <ROGOFF.96May24092116@sccm.Stanford.EDU> <4oa4fp$8pg@cantaloupe.srv.cs.cmu.edu>
Date: Tue, 28 May 1996 13:54:09 GMT
Lines: 29

In article <4oa4fp$8pg@cantaloupe.srv.cs.cmu.edu> nkramer@cs.cmu.edu
(Nick Kramer) writes: 

>I think you grossly underestimate how long it takes to write a usable
>compiler.  The Java people have only recently started what is probably
>a two year undertaking; the Dylan people are rapidly approaching
>release day.  

I suppose it depends on what you mean by "usable". There are a whole
stack of released Java compilers for Windows and Macs, as well as a
whole stack of integrated development environments available now
(Symantec, Metrowerks, Borland, etc). Others are in beta (Microsoft).
See <http://www.cybercom.net/~frog/javaide.html> for a list.

Perhaps CodeWarrior won't be up to what an Apple Dylan environment
might have been, and Java Workshop (Sun) might not be up to what CMU's
environment will be like. I'm not arguing that, just pointing out that
there are plenty of released compilers and development environments
right now.

> And these are immature compilers.  To match the
>"quality" of today's C++ compilers will take an additional few years.

This is certainly correct, especially in terms of optimization. My
personal opinion is that it will be hard for the Java compilers to
ever close that last couple of percent in performance as compared to
highly optimized C or C++ with safety checks disabled.

					- Marty
