Newsgroups: comp.lang.dylan
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From: hall@aplcenmp.apl.jhu.edu (Marty Hall)
Subject: Re: Java vs. Dylan - what to do?
Message-ID: <DqMtuB.CKD@aplcenmp.apl.jhu.edu>
Organization: JHU/APL Research Center, Hopkins P/T CS Faculty
References: <ddyer-2804961424560001@192.0.2.1>
Date: Mon, 29 Apr 1996 16:30:11 GMT
Lines: 40

In <ddyer-2804961424560001@192.0.2.1> ddyer@netcom.com (Dave Dyer) writes:
>
>Why does the Java newsgroup get 500 messages a day, while this one
>limps along with 5?  

My personal opinion is that it is wrong to attribute the Java
explosion to the language itself. Java is not a bad language, and it
tried to keep its syntax pretty close to C++ in order to attact C++
users. Although it is not nearly as nice inherently as Dylan, it has
some good features to make up for its lack of first class
functions/methods, multiple inheritance, and macros. For instance, it
has a standard FFI to C, (missing in Lisp), builtin support for
threads and concurrency control operators, and a standard portable
graphics library.

But, IMHO, that is *not* nearly enough to have gained much of a
foothold without the "killer app" of WWW execution. But this is one
whale of a killer app. This is not to say a language like Dylan
couldn't be used in such a role, but the fact is that Java got there
first. My uninformed guess is that it will take a long time and/or a
concerted effort by a big player like Microsoft to displace Java from
that role now that it has grabbed it.

>Mindy is just such a (stone age) tool as JDK.  Based on the sheer number
>of IDE's that have spung up for Java, they can't be that hard to produce.
>
>Or take that long.

I think they *are* relatively hard to produce.

They've been popping up all over the place for Java because vendors
think they will make money and thus risk a lot of development time and
money on them. With Apple not pushing Dylan, few (one?) vendors
think they will make enough money to justify such an IDE for Dylan.

Sad, but (IMHO) true.

Cheers-
					- Marty
(proclaim '(inline skates))
