From newshub.ccs.yorku.ca!ists!helios.physics.utoronto.ca!news-server.ecf!news-server.csri.toronto.edu!psych.toronto.edu!christo Tue May 12 15:49:14 EDT 1992
Article 5432 of comp.ai.philosophy:
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>From: christo@psych.toronto.edu (Christopher Green)
Subject: Re: re re ai failures
Organization: Department of Psychology, University of Toronto
References: <zlsiida.112@fs1.mcc.ac.uk> <1992May1.193141.24350@psych.toronto.edu> <zlsiida.144@fs1.mcc.ac.uk>
Message-ID: <1992May6.171350.3830@psych.toronto.edu>
Date: Wed, 6 May 1992 17:13:50 GMT

In article <zlsiida.144@fs1.mcc.ac.uk> zlsiida@fs1.mcc.ac.uk (dave budd) writes:
>In article <1992May1.193141.24350@psych.toronto.edu> christo@psych.toronto.edu (Christopher Green) writes:
>
>>In article <zlsiida.112@fs1.mcc.ac.uk> zlsiida@fs1.mcc.ac.uk (dave budd) writes:
>>>I don't kill anything myself except for food or clothing or
>>>in self protection.  
>
>>Really???!!!! Do you breathe (in things)? Do you walk (on things)?
>               --------------------------  -----------------------
>               No intentionality           Not if I see them
>  
It's not killing if there's no intentionality?! How 'bout drunk dirvers?

>>Do you occasionally get insects in your eye?
>                         -------------------
>The insect dies because it hits me, not because I hit it.

A matter of opinion, I'm sure.
>
> Do you sometimes slap them
>                  ----------
>>dead just because they're annoying -- say, mosquitos? 
> ----
>Only if they actually attack
>
This counts as self-defense?

>Do you buy silly
>>little trinkets from foreign countries where working conditions contribute
>>to the early death of the workers? 
>              -------------------
>No
>
I doubt it. Take a look at the labels on your clothes and canned good once.
>
>Do you ever buy flowers? Did you know
>>that in the greenhouses in which carnations are grown the workers are sprayed
>>with pesticides daily? 
>
>I personally have never forced anybody to work in a pesticide-loaded 
>environment, and I would be more than happy to pay extra or accept the 
>occasional bug in my flowers.
>
Perhaps you better take a look at the systems of which you're a part.
Do you drink coffee? Tea? Eat chocolate, or any sugar product?
Hitler didn't "personally" shove Jews into ovens. Does that make him
innocent?

>> Do you buy tuna, the catching of which leads to the
>>death of hundreds of thousands of dolphins and whales annually? Do you ever
> --------------------------------------------------------------
>How many?  I buy the stuff labelled 'dolphin-friendly'.  
>
>>fly in planes, which kill millions of birds annually?
>                      ----------------------
>I suppose it could be millions, lots of planes about.  Only flown twice, and
>one of those was a 4 seater where I'd have noticed a bird strike.
>
Clever answers. I see you righteousness is well defended. Dangerous.
>
>No because I don't think it was self-righteousness
>And in any case, as I said, a lot of nonsense gets talked about when it is
>or isn't OK to kill.  Regardless of moral or ethical codes or laws I think
>you'll find history shows that killing happens whenever it's expedient.

But, course, you're never involved. And you're not being self-righteous.
I see. :-(

-- 
Christopher D. Green                christo@psych.toronto.edu
Psychology Department               cgreen@lake.scar.utoronto.ca
University of Toronto
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