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Article 2778 of comp.ai.philosophy:
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>From: zeleny@zariski.harvard.edu (Mikhail Zeleny)
Newsgroups: comp.ai.philosophy,sci.philosophy.tech,sci.logic
Subject: Re: Penrose on Man vs. Machine
Message-ID: <1992Jan16.112129.7632@husc3.harvard.edu>
Date: 16 Jan 92 16:21:27 GMT
References: <1992Jan14.211840.2423@arizona.edu> <1992Jan15.143037.7600@husc3.harvard.edu> <1992Jan15.222457.4889@galois.mit.edu>
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In article <1992Jan15.222457.4889@galois.mit.edu> 
jbaez@jordan.mit.edu (John C. Baez) writes:

>In article <1992Jan15.143037.7600@husc3.harvard.edu> 
>zeleny@zariski.harvard.edu (Mikhail Zeleny) writes:

>>In article <1992Jan14.211840.2423@arizona.edu> 
>>bill@NSMA.AriZonA.EdU (Bill Skaggs) writes:

>>>In article <1992Jan14.182546.7560@husc3.harvard.edu> 
>>>zeleny@zariski.harvard.edu (Mikhail Zeleny) writes:

MZ:
>>>>To sum up, my position is that, were I a Turing machine, there would exist
>>>>some formal mathematical theory whose meaning I couldn't understand.
>>>>Personally, I find this implausible; feel free to judge to the contrary.

BS:
>>>  What a remarkable claim!  Are you saying that if I create an axiom
>>>system consisting of 10^100 axioms, each 10^1000 symbols long, you
>>>would be able to understand it?  I envy you.  I myself have never
>>>been able to understand quantum gravity, which is surely trivial
>>>in comparison.
>>>
>>>  Or what exactly are you saying?
>>>
>>>	-- Bill

MZ:
>>You create it, and I'll understand it, provided that there is anything to
>>understand.  One proviso: the axioms must all be written by hand, in your
>>handwriting.  

JB:
>Curioser and curioser: there is no formal mathematical theory whose
>meaning he can't understand, and yet his optical character recognition
>is so bad he cannot read typewritten material!

If I have to make an effort to understand it, he has to make an effort to
write it down.  See Emile Durkheim, "De la division du travail social":
it's all for the sake of social cohesion.

`'`'`'`'`'`'`'`'`'`'`'`'`'`'`'`'`'`'`'`'`'`'`'`'`'`'`'`'`'`'`'`'`'`'`'
: Qu'est-ce qui est bien?  Qu'est-ce qui est laid?         Harvard   :
: Qu'est-ce qui est grand, fort, faible...                 doesn't   :
: Connais pas! Connais pas!                                 think    :
:                                                             so     :
: Mikhail Zeleny                                                     :
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